The Problem with the “Try MonaVie” Argument

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Many distributors come here with an argument of “try the juice” under the theory that you shouldn’t knock it until you try it. I know a couple dozen other people who have tried the juice. All felt nothing. Why? Because it is the juice of fruit. That means that if you start out with a bowl of fruit, and took out the good stuff like most of the fiber, vitamins, and minerals, you’d have juice – just like MonaVie. Ever look at a MonaVie nutritional label? It is essentially empty. The reason why the people I know feel nothing on MonaVie is because they understand that it can’t possibly be better than fruit with all the good stuff stripped out. Furthermore there are many frequent commenters here who have tried the juice and found nothing.

In addition to that, the “try MonaVie” argument fails when you consider there are more than 5000 products in any VitaminWorld or GNC. Is it possible to try all those? Do you have the millions of dollars to try them all over time? If you did try them all, and you felt “something” (as most distributors refer to whatever MonaVie is mysteriously supposed to do), how would you know which product caused it (or if it was caused by a slight change in diet or weather or something else)?

There are two reasons why some people claim that they feel “something” with MonaVie. One of them is called the placebo effect. It’s like when a mom kisses a four-year-olds boo-boo to make it better. The four-year-old says he feels better. MonaVie distributors want to believe that the juice does something, because it gives them hope that it is the solution to their (and their friends and families) money and health concerns. It’s a good fairy tale, but unfortunately the scientific evidence doesn’t back it up. Other MonaVie distributors are simply lying because they realize that people aren’t going to pay the $45 retail price of MonaVie on taste alone (since Men’s Journal Proved MonaVie Lacks Nutrition.

If the product really does do anything, then let’s see how it sells on a retail shelf. There’s too much bias from MonaVie distributors looking to make money pitching as some kind of magical elixir that makes people feel better (for some completely unknown reason). You might as well make a tin foil hat to feel better.

Originally posted 2010-09-04 15:21:56. Republished by Blog Post Promoter

The above article is intended to be accurate at the time of its original posting. MonaVie may change its pricing, product, or other policies at any time without notice.

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Posted by MonaVie Scam on June 26, 2017 in monavie. You can skip to the end and leave a response. Pinging is currently not allowed.

80 Responses to “The Problem with the “Try MonaVie” Argument”
  1. MonaVie Scam Says:

    Suzy,

    Humiliated made a good point about the servings of fruit. However, there is another article that I wrote months and months ago that is relevant when you compare MonaVie to eating 13 servings of fruit: Drinking MonaVie is Not Equal to Eating 13 Fruits.

    I understand that you are still going to try MonaVie, and that’s your choice.

    The “science” to support MonaVie is conducted by MonaVie’s Alexander Schauss. It is marketing dressed up to look like science. Most of the studies have already been discussed on this website and I gave you a list of many doctors who are not affiliated with MonaVie who say that MonaVie is essentially a waste of money.

    The reason why the debate won’t end is because MonaVie is creating misconceptions such as the 13 fruits one and paying people to spread the word because that’s how they are able $50 juice.

    Insanity is ignoring logic and you’ve ignored about 30 relevant logical points now without presenting any of your own to support MonaVie. You say that you committed to buying a case at around $35 a bottle – it doesn’t make any sense why you wouldn’t pay less than $25 bottle and get a case on Ebay. If you were truly interested in trying it, that’s what any logical person would do.

  2. Vogel Says:

    Suzy: “I imagine at this point the only intelligent comments made are the ones that agree with the topic.”

    If you meant that the most intelligent comments here have been in line with the notion that Monavie is a scam, then yes, you are correct. That’s because Monavie is a scam.

    Suzy: “I have nothing to prove to any of you.”

    You were trying to right up until your weak arguments were deflated. Now you don’t want to argue because your position cannot be defended.

    Suzy: “I understand very well how debates work.”

    Maybe you do and maybe you don’t, but one thing is clear – you are completely avoiding anything resembling a debate here. You made a few unsupportable statements and now you are running away because your fallacious logic has been exposed.

    Suzy: “There is science to support both sides.”

    No, there really isn’t. There is no science that supports the value of the product or any of the miracle cures you alluded to. There is science on one side and fantasy BS on the other.

    Suzy: “I have seen several studies done but I am sure you will all discredit those.”

    If you are sure that they can be discredited so easily, then why bother mentioning them.

  3. CGC Says:

    Suzy,

    “I do know that my family can hardly consume 13 servings of fruits and vegetables the size of their palm.”

    As impressed as I am by your claims of financial ease and a $6000 water filter, your parroting of that transparent falsehood dashes all your pretenses against the wall of basic common sense, and shows that indeed you have swallowed at least some of the Kool-Aid.

    “I imagine at this point the only intelligent comments made are the ones that agree with the topic.” So it seems. Why don’t you try breaking that trend with an intelligent comment? If you find one, let us know.

    The debate won’t end, not because there is science on both sides, the debate won’t end because there is money to be made deceiving people into thinking this fruit juice is somehow worth 20 times more than other juices and convincing them that a normal, non-sociopathic person can make money “doing the business”. See that 13-fruit opening quote as an example of this. MV has zero science indicating that it is superior to your run-of-the-mill grocery store 100% fruit fruit juice. That is zero, none, not one single credible scientific study. But there are lots of anecdotes, from people selling the stuff of course, and from those “not a distributor” types who mysteriously seem to know a lot of people drinking MV and getting healthier because of it. What circles one must run in to know these folks I can only imagine.

    If you wanted the best option for your family you would avoid this scammy product and make fresh, whole fruit smoothies for them. It is much cheaper and much healthier and you won’t be sending money up a pyramid to liars and cheats like Dallin Larsen and Brig Hart.

    But that’s just my opinion, based on a thorough analysis of the evidence.

  4. Roger Says:

    Suzy mentioned that ‘It costs an average family far more to eat healthy then to slowly kill themselves.’

    If she’s based in Australia like I am, then that’s not as inane a comment as one overseas might be led to believe – here we pay $5 for a kilo of apples, $2 to $3 for iceberg lettuce, $2 to $5 for a single cucumber, $3 to $4 for a kilo of oranges, $14 to $20 for a kilo of steak. Or you can go to Dominos or Eagle Boys and buy a family sized pizza for $4.95 take-away.
    The average hourly wage for a regular worker (non-professional) is around $aud 15 per hour – that should help one put things in perspective.

    No wonder the number of families not cooking their own meals anymore on a regular basis is dwindling.

    The long and short of MonaVie is that it is GROSSLY OVERPRICED for what it is.

    Aloe Commodities, of Carrolton, TX, is a private label manufacturer who also manufactures a product that I market, I’m not sure if they still have the contract to formulate and bottle the Mona Vie Juices (not the energy drink, got no idea who manufactures that for them), but they did until some time last year. They also do Goji, as well as some Nutriway (Amway) and USANA products as well as some of the Herbalife formulation.

    Straight from the horse’s mouth (Stewart McKnight – co-owner of the company), the Mona Vie juices are less than $5 including bottling, labelling and boxing, so if dear Suzy is forking out $35 per bottle, plus shipping, that in my book constitutes a rip-off.

    The product I market, that’s manufactured by Aloe Commodities, sells for $1 per serving, cost to the MLM company behind the product is around 25c per serving.

    Most of MonaVie’s acai by the way doesn’t originate from Brazil in the form of freeze-dried fruit, but as a puree from Bolivia. The ORAC score of freeze-dried fruit is far higher than that of reconstituted juice purees.

    Drinking MonaVie is not equivalent to eating 13 serves of fruit, it is supposedly equivalent to ingesting the equivalent antioxidant value of 13 serves of fruit. There’s a difference.

    if Suzy has no interest in ‘another business’ – here’s a thought – want to make a REAL DIFFERENCE in the world – ditch MonaVie and slip on down to your local Health Food store and get yourself some wheatgrass or barley grass powder, mix with non-Monavie Juice, and get more nutrition than MonaVie will ever give you, and the money you save, donate it to one of the charities that are helping with the crisis in Somalia. It’s a win-win-win situation – your body, your wallet, and the starving children of africa.

  5. Roger Says:

    MonaVie Summary of Worldwide Sales – looks to me the company’s going backwards overall. Why do they tout to be a billion dollar company when their annual turn-over is around $500m ?

    Listed from Largest to Smallest

    52 week avg. Last 4 Week avg. Change

    US $9,759,373 $7,085,100 -27.4%
    JP $1,167,971 $1,495,816 28.1%
    CA $979,415 $944,195 -3.6%
    AU $287,164 $223,989 -22.0%
    SG $223,692 $164,528 -26.4%
    MX $145,551 $125,850 -13.5%
    PL $98,068 $98,310 0.2%
    BR $56,114 $83,680 49.1%
    IL $41,526 $71,165 71.4%
    UK $67,034 $64,812 -3.3%
    FR $20,797 $32,540 56.5%
    NZ $34,118 $19,394 -43.2%
    HK $8,367 $8,367 0.0%

    TOTAL $12,757,845 $10,413,560 -18.4%

    http://www.sequenceinc.com/fraudfiles/2010/05/an-anonymous-source-reveals-numbers-for-monavie/

  6. Suzy Says:

    Good morning! I do believe I have finally unsubscribed to this madness. I wish I had the time to fight your debate, as in life there is something that supports every side of an argument. It would, of course, be easier if I had three or more gang busters to help me out. Unfortunately, I can not humor you as I far too much to do.

    I have invested a lot in organic foods, I assure you. I am not exactly sure where your getting your figures, but buying organic can cost me two-three times what it cost to buy general populated food, loaded with GMO’s, steroids, antibiotics, etc. Lucky for me I have that income, but I have never had the results with arthritis my friend has had with Monavie. I have juiced aloe, wheat grass, sea weed, and whole fruit. Even I tried an acai juice from my local vitamin and mineral shop. Nope still couldn’t seem to prove my friends who being railroaded in anyway. So in order to see for myself I will try it. Good Health is not something you can see & over the years I have done more for my health & my family health through my own proactive behavior then any doctor could ever do. But never have I achieved the results that my friend with diabetes has achieved, 6 months ago we celebrated her blood sugar returning to a normal level and no longer needing insulin after 60 days on the Active.

    I was skeptical and even called it voodoo in a bottle, but I have to put my money where my mouth is. I said if I could no longer ignore the results then I would try it. So I am. If i find it to be less then expected I will report it here in a total truth. But I refuse to debate any longer about opinion. It feels like a religious form. “God is real.” “No he isn’t” “Yes he is.” “Prove it.” “no, you prove he isn’t.”

    Science is not perfect. Doctors & scientist have been going back and forth for years. It is call professional opinion for a reason. I do agree that distributors should not take advantage of innocent people and request that they front load cases as I have read here, or put themselves in situations that are financially exhausting. I personally watched several of my friends build at different speeds. At least one of which was not in the same financial position as some of the rest of them and had to work hard to budget her business in, but never did I see her feel pressure to spend money she didn’t have.

    Although I did ask about Team Monavie and they made it clear that they were not part of that organization and were part of some R3 something or another. Not sure what that means. But I feel confident to try for myself. To get answers for myself. I did not order enough for my family, it will be just myself trying it. & my friend confirmed she gave me her wholesale price at 140 tax and all, using her unlimited shipping and would be willing to show me. I would not order form ebay because I like to order from people I trust. & to say the least why wouldn’t people take advantage of at least working to offset the cost of their case. I do believe that if I love it as much as they do I will share with enough friends to get mine free. I can not do that on ebay! Just saying!

    You will have to excuse my grammar this time! i was in a hurry and no time to proof my response. have an amazing day!

  7. Roger Says:

    R3 global is Brig Hart’s team, check this guy out – the master of hype – http://www.r3global.com/the-system/diamond-run/

  8. MonaVie Scam Says:

    Whether or not people buy organic is not relevant to MonaVie. If you do believe in buying organic food, you shouldn’t try MonaVie, because it is not organic. In fact, it has been shown that Brazil is a world leader in using the most amount of pesticides. You could instead choose an acai juice product like Sambazon (amongst others) that is certified organic.

    It is completely unreasonable to suggest that MonaVie help with diabetes

    I agree it does sound like a religious forum – and that’s what MonaVie wants. You can look at Brig Hart at R3Global and he’ll do mass baptizing of new people in the business – no joke. The difference is that there’s a wealth of science on the side of MonaVie being ordinary juice, no different than Ocean Spray or Welch’s and no evidence for MonaVie – seriously try to find any. It is impossible to prove whether somewhere in the world a juggling indigo penguin exists. No one can prove the juggling indigo penguin doesn’t exist. The burden of proof of someone making the claim is to show that it does exist. MonaVie is in the same situation. We’ve seen thousands of penguins and juices that are penguins and juices – no indigo and no juggling – no healing from medical conditions.

    If MonaVie thinks they have a juice that can do that, they can show it in large scale clinical trials for the FDA, get approval to make such claims, and make tens of billions of dollars in the next 12 months. Why do you think MonaVie hasn’t taken this action? Is it because they wouldn’t like tens of billions of dollars helping people? No. It is because they know that all “results” rely on the placebo effect. So remember that MonaVie can prove its product and chooses not to. The existence of God or juggling penguins aren’t similar.

    Science actually is as close to perfect as we as a society have gotten. Why don’t you spend the next hour thinking about which parts of your life has been influenced by science? Watch TV, microwave some food, communicate over the Internet. This is all science. It isn’t the professional opinion that the Internet works.

    You make a point about getting your juice for free. You should read this article about the $8 gas station: http://mlmmyth.org/the-mlm-gas-station-and-8-gallon-gas/. For you to get your juice for free, you have to inflict a ton of debt on your “friends” (some friend you are). You all would be better off just buying from Ebay.

  9. Vogel Says:

    Suzy initially said: “Since a good portion of my friends who are enjoying MonaVie are not distributors I am not sure there is any substance to wanting it to work because of the opportunity to make money.”

    But then Suzy said: “I personally watched several of my friends build at different speeds. At least one of which was not in the same financial position as some of the rest of them and had to work hard to budget her business in, but never did I see her feel pressure to spend money she didn’t have. Although I did ask about Team Monavie and they made it clear that they were not part of that organization and were part of some R3 something or another.”

    And later Suzy let this slip: “I am bored with it at this point because what you are saying I have never seen within the pact of approximately 10 or so friends in various involvement with Monavie.”

    You’re so full of it Suzy. First you came here making claims about your friends experiencing miracle cures, and you implied that these people are trustworthy because they aren’t in the business. But then you turn around and make it clear that they are in fact in the business. That explains why they claimed that Monavie is a cure-all — they (just like you) are financially incentivized to exaggerate and confabulate.

    You’ve spouted just about every standard deceptive party-line meme in defense of Monavie that all the other distributors use, and in doing so, you have blown your cover story and your credibility. When you’re asked to back up anything that you’ve claimed you run a away saying that you don’t have the time or that it would be futile because we wouldn’t believe you. You’re a useless second-rate spammer con artist.

    And in the Monavie tradition, I can trash you as much as I like as long as I sign off with…

    …”have a nice day and God bless”.

  10. Vogel Says:

    Suzy said: “I do not have to make another income & generally I am not moved by money.”

    That was the post where you pretend to be financially independent and not financially motivated to post BS about Monavie…

    Suzy said: “I am not sure I have the time or interest in becoming a distributor but I am in face committing to drinking the 4 ounces of juice daily. ;-)”

    …and in that post you pretend to be uninterested in being a distributor…

    Suzy said: “I do not need to sell a juice to make a better living.”

    …then for good measure, you reiterate the claim that you aren’t selling juice and aren’t motivated by money…

    Suzy said: “I have invested in a 6000 dollars water filtration system, not really affordable for the average household.”

    …then you make this claim to make it appear that you’re wealthy and that money is no object to you…

    Suzy said: “Not interested in filling my time with just another business, as I feel me and my husband have built an empire of my own. I haven’t much time to invest in an venture. But I will try the juice w/o bias.”

    …then you reiterate this “I’m-wealthy-and-don’t-need-money-and-don’t-sell-Monavie” BS…

    But then Suzy tipped her hand by saying this: “I would not order form ebay because I like to order from people I trust. & to say the least why wouldn’t people take advantage of at least working to offset the cost of their case. I do believe that if I love it as much as they do I will share with enough friends to get mine free. I can not do that on ebay! Just saying!”

    So let me get this straight Suzy, you little confabulator — you repeatedly insisted that you’re wealthy; that you don’t need money; that you have no intention of selling Monavie; and that you aren’t financially motivated to plug the product here. But then in one fell swoop you blow your cover and state that you’ll be selling Monavie because doing so would you give you the opportunity to offset your juice cost (even though E-Bay sells it at the lowest possible wholesale price).

    Did I mention that you’re bloody ridiculous?

  11. Suzy Says:

    I haven’t signed up for anything. Paid cash! No cover to be blown. ;-) Just to correct you on the things in which you have no link and no argument. I am not a distributor and have no desire to put yet another business responsibility on myself. Do you have a link to prove me wrong? A science study that might provide an educated guess suggesting that I am this Brig guy in incognito. I am becoming amused!

  12. Suzy Says:

    I looked at part of your video link! I have a question??? ..AND? Not sure what I was supposed to get all huffy about. I don’t have time to watch the whole thing now I have a meeting. Everything I have said is truthful and the fact that you have made an argument out of what I have shared and said just shows how you go out of your way to pick apart anyone even if the truth is being told. You have to be right, even when your “bloody” wrong. I married into money, I was lucky. I still feel some here are jaded.

    With that note I will recognize that it appears some distributors have taken advantage of people spending money they do not have. But I do not find that each distributor’s behavior is on Monavie’s hands. I do not understand why you are not spending more time holding individuals responsible for not conducting ethical business and helping verses hurting people. Once again just saying!

  13. Roger Says:

    http://www.mensjournal.com/superjuices-on-trial
    is a good article, comparing various juices including MonaVie.

    Suzy would be well advised to give Welch’s juice a go. $3 for a 32 oz bottle, works out at $0.75/serving, compared to MonaVie, which has LESS nutrition, at around $1.20/serving, and compares poorly.

    I’d be inclined to recommend ditch MonaVie’s overpriced juice and take something like Welch’s, and donate the money you save to a charity helping the starving people of Somalia…

  14. Vogel Says:

    Suzy said: “But I do not find that each distributor’s behavior is on Monavie’s hands.”

    How did you come to that conclusion? Is that simply an uneducated opinion that you pulled out of yer arse just now, or do you think there is some basis in law for the assertion?

    Suzy said: “I do not understand why you are not spending more time holding individuals responsible for not conducting ethical business and helping verses hurting people.”

    In fact, we’re trying to do exactly that, but why on earth would you hold us responsible for policing the conduct of distributors? Are you not aware that the task is the company’s responsibility?

    Suzy said: “Everything I have said is truthful and the fact that you have made an argument out of what I have shared and said just shows how you go out of your way to pick apart anyone even if the truth is being told.”

    So you think that any troll who anonymously posts a comment with no backup evidence and says “I’m telling the truth” should be believed at face value? What kind of bizarre fantasy world do you live in?

  15. MonaVie Scam Says:

    Suzy said: “But I do not find that each distributor’s behavior is on Monavie’s hands.”

    As Vogel pointed out above, it is on MonaVie’s hands – legally. You may recall file sharing companies such as Napster and LimeWire tried to make the claim that their user’s behavior was not on their hands as well. That didn’t go well for either company. MonaVie is in worse legal shape than them because they actually pay the users, which is something the file sharing companies didn’t do.

    Read more: MonaVie is the Next Napster?

  16. Vogel Says:

    The funny thing is that Suzy already confessed that her friends who sell Protandim are making these miracle cure testimonials. So Suzy shouldn’t we be pinning blame on your a-hole friends as well as the company itself?

  17. humiliated Says:

    I think you meant to say MonaVie, Vogel, but these scam/cults are interchangeable!!!

    What I find odd is the only people that felt any benefit were those above me, making money. Those that I “recruited” felt no benefit at all. A coincidence? I think not.

    Something doesn’t ring true about Suzy’s post and I agree that she is not being completely up front with us. This “R3 something” and “Brig whatever” is a little to casually referenced with feigned ignoranance. I don’t buy it. If these sites were available when I first got conned into joining MonaVie, you can bet your bottom dollar I would be checking this company out with independant resources and experts, not wasting my time arguing with us. I wouldn’t have gotten past the pyramid scheme/cult thing, but I guess that doesn’t bother Suzy.

    Us, jaded? That is the understatment of the year Suzy. We are spitting mad that these scams are continuing to operate and take advantage of people. We are horrified that the FTC doesn’t have the funding to start shutting these companies down. We are disgusted with people coming on here and saying things like “Monavie contains 13 servings of fruits and vegetables” when it is a blatant lie. We are appalled that people have lost their homes, friendships and relationships with family members because of their involvement with this cult. I know, I know…we are horrible people.

  18. Jim Says:

    Roger, on Sept. 19 you left a post including current and previous year sales figures. Can you please cite where those figures came from? Can you please provide a link, I would be very intersted in learning more.

    thanks

  19. MonaVie Scam Says:

    Roger got them from http://www.sequenceinc.com/fraudfiles/2010/05/an-anonymous-source-reveals-numbers-for-monavie/

    I updated the comment to reflect that.

  20. Roger Says:

    that’s the link, thanks mate. Go knock yourself out, Jim !

  21. MonaVie Scam Says:

    Excellent post humiliated,

    I especially liked the point, “If these sites were available when I first got conned into joining MonaVie, you can bet your bottom dollar I would be checking this company out with independant resources and experts, not wasting my time arguing with us. I wouldn’t have gotten past the pyramid scheme/cult thing, but I guess that doesn’t bother Suzy.”

    You also have shown the ability to use logic and reason, where Suzy has refused dozens of logical arguments in favor of one that is not based on any logic.

  22. UtryTWOhard Says:

    Suzy,

    I look forward to hearing your progress and will check this site at least monthly to look for any updated info. If, (<<and that's a big if) you even decide to.

    Must be aggravating, being gang-banged when trying to state opinions and hear-say? Lol good luck to you.

  23. Suzy Says:

    Wow you guys never take a break. & Adults complain about children spending too much time on the computer these days. I would prefer to spend time in forums that are inviting to a variety of ideas. & respect towards humanity since that is a measure of character. I am still NOT a MonaVie distributor…nothings changed.

  24. Suzy Says:

    Let’s clarify that I never said I was wealthy, not even rich. I said I did not need the money. That gives you absolutely no evidence into my financial status.

  25. Vogel Says:

    Suzy said: “I would prefer to spend time in forums that are inviting to a variety of ideas.”

    You’re here now, so we’ll have to take your comment as a tacit acknowledgement that this forum is “inviting to a variety of ideas”. Otherwise, why would you be here? No one is forcing you to act against your stated preference.

    Suzy said: “Let’s clarify that I never said I was wealthy, not even rich. I said I did not need the money. That gives you absolutely no evidence into my financial status.”

    By “clarify”, you clearly meant “obfuscate”. Since you started posting here, you haven’t stopped telling us about your rosy financial situation. You told us that you married into money; that you are financially independent and have “built an empire”, and that you have more money than the average household. It wasn’t even relevant to anything being discussed here. You only went down this road because you thought that you could rid yourself of the taint of a financial conflict of interest by simply portraying yourself as someone who is financially well off. Do you see anyone else here bragging about their wealth? No, you deluded, arrogant, bloviating fool. Here are a few of the highlights of your incessant bragging:

    “I do not have to make another income & generally I am not moved by money”

    “I do have the expendable income…I can invest in my families health! I do not need to sell a juice to make a better living.”

    “I have invested in a 6000 dollars water filtration system, not really affordable for the average household.”

    “Not interested in filling my time with just another business, as I feel me and my husband have built an empire of my own.”

    “I have invested a lot in organic foods…Lucky for me I have that income.”

    “I married into money, I was lucky.”

  26. Vogel Says:

    Hey Roger, I was looking over that worldwide sales data again and I can’t say that I trust it. I don’t believe that Monavie could possibly be doing anywhere close to even $500 mil in annual sales. Odwalla only does $188 mil a year and they are in every supermarket and corner store in the country.

    I also noticed that the data allegedly came from a source claimed to be an anonymous credible company insider. It appears that Tracy Coenen broke this story first (on May 3, 2010). She said:

    “I received the following information about multi-level marketing company MonaVie via email from an anonymous source… Note that I have not verified the accuracy of the assumptions in this article from the anonymous source.”
    http://www.sequenceinc.com/fraudfiles/2010/05/an-anonymous-source-reveals-numbers-for-monavie/

    The anonymous source to whom Coenen referred to said the following about where the data came from:

    “It comes from a very credible source inside the company and is something that the common distributor or customer would never see from a private company.”

    To reiterate, Coenen’s anonymous source claims to be providing second-hand information from an alleged company insider. Also notice that the anonymous source didn’t specifically state whether the figures represented weekly, monthly, quarterly, or annual sales averages.

    A few months later, an even more detailed version of this data, allegedly obtained independently of Coenen, appeared in an article by Ted Nuyten (an ardent MLM loyalist to say the least) on August 8, 2010. His new slicker presentation of the data suddenly included annual sales totals, and they ranged from $663 mil to $541 mil. As to the source of the data, Nuyten claimed the following:

    “Business For Home.org received information about MonaVie’s revenue from an anonymous source. We guess it is an insider / employee who is for some reason not happy with the company.”
    http://www.businessforhome.org/2010/08/monavie-revenue-2010-under-heavy-pressure/

    Five days later (Aug 13), Nuyten claimed that he had received a cease and desist order from Monavie’s lawyers (at the firm Strong & Hanni) because of his release of the sales data. [Note that more than year has passed and the information is still on Nuyten’s site and no followup legal action has been reported.] Nuyten also changed his story about the source of the data. He had originally claimed that he received it from an anonymous source, but then admitted that in fact he got it from Coenen’s article.
    http://www.businessforhome.org/2010/08/monavie-letter-to-ted-nuyten-regarding-the-reported-revenue-for-2010/

    A couple of days after Nuyten received the CDO, MLM lickspittle Troy Dooly (a self described buddy of Dallin Larsen) jumped in with an oddball entry that included a discussion about the articles by Coenen and Huyten and Monavie’s subsequent CDO to Nuyten, and a very strange propagandistic interview with Dallin Larsen. Conspicuously, Larsen didn’t mention anything about a leak from the inside (or elsewhere for that matter); in fact he didn’t address the issue at all and neither confirmed nor denied the accuracy of the sales figures. But Dooly got all irate and started an idiotic rant about how the alleged whistleblower should be prosecuted for having committed a felony (even though there was absolutely no evidence that a felony had taken place — it would have been a civil suit at best).
    http://mlmhelpdesk.com/2010/08/17/monavie-founder-dallin-larsen-shares-about-the-acai-berry-juice-company-after-anonymous-rumors-start-flying/#comments

    I’ve read Coenen’s writing before and I think she’s legit and credible, but I don’t trust the sales data at all (nor do I remotely trust Nuyten or Dooly), and all the subsequent coverage of these events reeks of BS. I think we’re all being scammed (not by Coenen though).

    Here are a couple of possibilities to consider: (a) the original data were leaked on purpose by Monavie to make it seem as though they are generating $500 mil plus in annual sales; (b) the data were leaked to Coenen by a bona fide whistleblower but the totals represented monthly or quarterly averages, and Nuyten erred by inferring that these were annual averages. Dooly’s article seemed like a canard to throw people off the trail; to keep them from even asking the question “are the data real?” Dooly never raised that glaringly obvious question once. Larsen completely avoided saying anything about it. It looks as though Larsen and Dooly really wanted the public to believe that the sales data and the story about the insider leak were real, but they were careful to not directly confirm nor deny anything.

    Even the CDO from Strong & Hanni reeks of BS. A junior partner at the firm writes a ridiculous groundless CDO to Nuyten (a pro-MLMer), who merely based his article on the data Coenen reported, and yet there’s no evidence that they ever sent a CDO to Coenen, who first broke the story 3 months before Nuyten’s article appeared. Nor does it appear that any followup action was taken against Nuyten even though his article is still online. Nothing about this adds up.

    Prior to any of these events taking place, many of us here were very loudly skeptical of Monavie’s rumored earnings, mainly because the company is privately held and such claims cannot be verified (and everyone in the organization that we encountered was a chronic liar). So how convenient would it be for the company to nip this controversy in the bud by planting a “credible anonymous source” to leak some false data showing exaggerated revenue?

    I was equally skeptical of Monavie’s $854 million revenue claim for 2008 that appeared in Inc. Magazine. Rightly so too — it turned out that it was an unaudited revenue claim submitted directly by Monavie without being verified independently. This was confirmed on Jan 28, 2010 by Jim Melloan, an Inc Magazine project manager who works on the Inc 500 list.
    http://www.inc.com/inc5000/2009/the-full-list.html
    http://www.juicescam.com/monavie-and-inc-magazines-500/

    Let’s ignore for the moment that neither Inc Magazine’s nor the anonymous whistelblower’s revenue claims are reliable — the data do show that Monavie’s annual sales in early 2010 ($541 according to Nuyten) were about one-third lower than what Monavie had claimed to Inc Magazine for fiscal 2008 ($854 mil). That’s an even heftier decline than the -25% that Nuyten mentioned. But in reality, it’s probably much much worse than that (i.e., far lower annual revenue than claimed and a much bigger decline than they are willing to admit to).

  27. humiliated Says:

    If what you are saying is true Vogel, it is truly twisted. Why would they “leak” a 33% reduction though? Why not a 22% reduction?

    I do recall wondering why Dallin never addressed the actual numbers in his little performance with Dooley. I agree with you that the numbers seem out of line compared to Odwalla.

  28. Bella Says:

    Suzy…have fun in your endeavors. ;)

    A dear friend of mine got doped into this Monavie BS and was going to get me into it too. I was skeptical and still am. He quit being a distributor and I have yet to find out what happened. I just wish he did his homework and learned what a scam it is. He still believes in the benefits of the products. He sent me two bottles of the MV Active but I think it’s making me sick. I’ve had a terrible headache now for the last couple days. I can function but I didn’t expect a bottle juice could make me feel this bad. Lazy Man, thank you for all your work in exposing this fraudulent company. And I’m smiling as I dump the rest of this crap in the sink.

  29. crazy hog Says:

    i have never tried mona vie nor will i.

    but i saw it said mona vie is a cult

    i have read all your posts and i can say one thing

    the people who lobby mona vie in a negative way are just as stupid as those who lobby for it.

    no one has taken any thing positive that was said about mona vie seriously.
    all you do is feed off each others negativity.

    your all a bunch of losers. some tings work well for some people (due to metabolisms being different in every person in the world) and to say that the product is a scam is just ridiculous

    sure the business model is. no question. but the juice…. i dont care if it is placebo. if it works it works.

    if you have cancer and was told to chew mint gum and it cured it would that be a lie? knowing that gum has no healing properties. if it works for you do it.

    idiots

  30. MonaVie Scam Says:

    The problem is that people are told that acai has some magical benefits that can cure things like cancer, which it can’t. People know that gum can’t cure cancer.

    As for some things working for some people, let’s be straight-forward here. We know how to repair broken bones, it works for everyone. We know how to prevent Polio, it works for everyone (or at least damn near everyone best I can tell). It’s not people are random and behave extremely differently to different things. It’s not like cinnamon toast can cure my neighbor’s son’s autism. We have a very strong degree in confidence in what is going to work and what is not going to work.

    It doesn’t work, there’s never been any proof that it has done anything for a single person. The person who invented MonaVie even said that it’s just juice. If it’s being marketed as anything different than Juicy Juice or Ocean Spray, it’s straight up fraud. And it is being marketed as being different. Fraud is not acceptable in any way shape or form.

    Then you have the ridiculous business model driving people to make these illegal and fraudulent claims. How is that okay? Maybe it’s only okay in Crazy Hog world.

 
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