MonaVie is the Next Napster?


MonaVie and Napster seem to have a lot in common

Here’s the Napster case description directly from Wikipedia:

The music industry made the following claims against Napster:

(1) That its users were directly infringing the plaintiff’s copyright;
(2) That Napster was liable for contributory infringement of the plaintiff’s copyright; and
(3) That Napster was liable for vicarious infringement of the plaintiff’s copyright.

The court found Napster liable on all three claims.

Napster lost the case in the District Court and appealed to the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit. Although the Ninth Circuit found that Napster was capable of commercially significant non-infringing uses, it affirmed the District Court’s decision. On remand, the District Court ordered Napster to monitor the activities of its network and to block access to infringing material when notified of that material’s location. Napster was unable to do this, and so shut down its service in July 2001.

Let’s see what we have here:
1) The company’s users were directly breaking the law
2) The company was liable for contributing to them breaking the law
3) The company was liable for vicariously breaking the law

The company went back and said that it’s product can be used in significant number of legitimately legal cases or which the court agreed on the condition that they stop the illegal uses. The company was unable to do this and shut down it’s business.

Now go back to the above synopsis of Napster and substitute “The company” for MonaVie. Doesn’t that seem ominous for MonaVie? What’s different? If I were a MonaVie distributor, I’d be very careful not to count on the income stream to feed my family.

The CEO in a Newsweek already said that it is unable to filter out the illegal activity:

Meanwhile an 18-person compliance department investigates distributors suspected of making false claims—although with a million sales people on the books, that’s easier said than done. “It’s next to impossible,” Larsen concedes, “like herding cats.”

Originally posted 2009-05-14 14:44:34. Republished by Blog Post Promoter

The above article is intended to be accurate at the time of its original posting. MonaVie may change its pricing, product, or other policies at any time without notice.

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Posted by MonaVie Scam on March 4, 2019 in MonaVie - Napster. You can skip to the end and leave a response. Pinging is currently not allowed.

43 Responses to “MonaVie is the Next Napster?”
  1. Hellraiser Says:

    In my opinion, enough proof (including the links) exists on this site to show that all 3 of the claims above are easily met.

    The sad aspect of the above scenario is that the distributors will be the real losers. The few at the top have already made their millions and can land on their feet to start another FRAUD..

    The other sad fact is that the distributors in monavie (just like RTL) fervently believe that the government will never shut down a rogue company like monavie. They fail to see reason and logic, and will therefore lose everything they have worked so hard for.

    If the company (including the distributors) cannot or will not police themselves, the government will have no choice but to police them (or more likely, shut the company down) to protect the public from harm.

    In October, I predict a new virus of unlawful testimonials endorsing the new weight loss program they are rolling out. I expect the new product (to claim) to be a meal replacement, not a supplement. That will fuel the fire and make monavie ripe for enforcement activities.

  2. Mackwiz Says:

    I don’t think they will be able to hide in that ‘herding cats’ loophole forever. Sooner or later they will be held accountable for the illegal distributor claims.

    I had a MonaVie spokesperson almost delcare the juice an alternative to prescription meds. Almost, just enough to get into the heads of distributors who then go to Facebook and various other places with back pain and headache cure claims. I can’t even stress how dangerous and irresponsible that is.

    It’s a pretty slick way to get around the law, I’ll admit, but it is unlikely to last long.

  3. Roger Says:

    My ex’s argument was “you owe it to your clients to recommend this juice to them as a Personal Trainer . . .

    A quick way to ruin your reputation.

    The real problem lies (pardon the pun) with the growing army of distributors, all fixated with the dream of residual income coming in from shifting boxes of the stuff, they find out its not as easy as they thought building the business, so they start stretching the truth.

    Unless I’ve missed something, it doesn’t seem to be the company itself doing most of the misleading, but individual distributors, hence the problem with distributor compliance comes into the picture. I would assume the company’s compliance department would discipline or terminate a distributor openly making extravagant claims, but if they’re not going very much by way of disciplinary action towards an rogue distributor, and letting many incidents slide, then this too is a pretty slick way to get around the law, but as Mackwiz so correctly pointed out, it is unlikely to last long, and before too long, the same thing will happen to Monavie as its predecessor, Monarch and its limu juice.

  4. humiliated Says:

    Roger, I was involved as well & I can assure you that the misinformation comes from the top. The “facts” I got from my up-line were straight from the horses ass, I mean mouth. At the conventions etc. they say something about the acai berry & then segue into Monavie making no distinction between the two. The distributor is thus fed false information in this manner so they can not really even be faulted for spreading the lies. It is extremely manipulative behavior on the part of Monavie Corporate, then they turn around and blame the distributors for spreading the false information stating that it is like “herding cats” in trying to control them. I think that is the sickest part of all of this, they clap their hands with glee in private because whatever sells the juice is the bottom line to them, yet they publicly scold their distributors.

    Au contraire regarding your assumption that Monavie’s compliance department is doing anything to punish their rogue distributors. You will find that they have actually rewarded distributors for lying (eg Lou Niles, child predator) and Mitch Biggs etc. and if you are interested, there are articles posted here regarding some of these super special distributors. The bloggers on this site behave more like a compliance department then anyone employed by Monavie because we actually care that these lies are being spread.

    I am sorry that your ex got involved with this cult & I am really glad that you escaped their clutches!

  5. healthy mom Says:

    As I read the comments, what is most obvious to me is that none of the comments are by people who actually know much of anything about our bodies and how we were created.
    The stupid people are the ones who will take any prescription a doctor gives them JUST because the doctor says to. The cult followers are those people.
    It baffles me as to why you people are out here ranting about this product and/or company. What are you trying to gain?
    Are you angry because top Amway leaders left to go to MonaVie?
    What exactly do distributors lose by consuming a product and sharing it with their friends?
    If it works for some people …. why does that bother you so much?
    These ridiculous websites are intended to spread lies (what you accuse others of doing)… It’s as simple as that.
    Sad. Very sad.

  6. MonaVie Scam Says:

    Healthy Mom,

    Umm, the people here know quite a bit about nutrition. However, if you don’t want to trust the people here I understand that. Why don’t you listen to Miriam Pappo, director of clinical nutrition at Montefiore Medical Center in New York and what the test reveal about MonaVie. Clearly this person knows a lot more about our bodies and “how we were created” than you or me, right? Turns out that MonaVie isn’t that nutritious in that article.

    Well considering doctors study our bodies just about every waking moment for at least a dozen years, perhaps they know a lot more about our bodies than you do. They save lives every day, so perhaps it’s a good thing to take the medicine they give you. This website has provided tons of irrefutable evidence supported by reputable third parties that MonaVie is a grossly overpriced product, with little nutritional value, wrapped in a poor business opportunity that may be an illegal pyramid scheme, which is itself wrapped in illegal medical claims, supported by nonsensical “scientific” studies, and tied to a fraudulent charity. I don’t see how it is cult-like to support health education at some of the top universities over that mess.

    Why would I care about Amway leaders going to MonaVie? How exactly is that relevant to anything?

    Distributors lose lots and lots of money and receive almost nothing in return. I don’t like to see people get scammed in this manner. It destroys marriages and lives.

    Please tell me what lies I am spreading. If you can prove them to be lies, I will edit the posts. That is the whole point to letting people comment openly.

  7. Mackwiz Says:

    Healthy Mom,

    1. The whole prescription medicine thing is a red-herring. For one, I haven’t met a reputable doctor who goes around saying “Don’t eat healthy, don’t exercise, just take pills.” You forget that your entire concept of healthy living was designed by MD’s who study the human body for a living. Anyway, you are just throwing out a conspiracy to take the attention off your “health” juice.

    2. Are you trying to say we are in Amway and are pissed about people jumping ship to MonaVie? I could care less. It should be rather enlightening to you that people involved in a previous controversial MLM have latched on to MonaVie. These people don’t care about your juice, they care about ripping money from people’s hands.

    3. It does work for some people, like 1% who get an income on this stuff. That means 99% get screwed. If you’re talking about health benefits, please do some research. We need more than hearsay to believe that MonaVie cures or helps with “insert disease/condition here”.

    4. Yeah, we’re “sad” and “pathetic”. At least the only thing I’m spending is time rather than time and hard earned money.

    The site has likely convinced hundreds if not thousands NOT to get involved with MonaVie. If the price to pay for telling the truth and helping people avoid this scam is a few pretentious turds calling us pathetic and sad from time to time, then I say it’s worth it.

  8. Yosef Katz Says:

    No one is convinced not to do an MLM/Network Marketing program from sites like this. It is actually better for the business, as those who join join with a more open perspective. It is better to know what you are up against when you undertake a business venture…any business venture. As for the efficacy of health juices I am sure that varies from person to person, from the person who doesn’t get enough fluid period, to the person who cannot take that much sugar and the jock who exercises regularly…etc. Many varied responses. As for nutrition, how can you mention nutrition along side a juice? It just doesn’t make sense…glad I don’t need to make claims about products, you either believe in and take vitamins or not, minerals, anti-oxidants and the like. I take them. I like them. You might as well, or not, up to you.

  9. MonaVie Scam Says:


    It seems from the emails I’ve received that many have been convinced not to do MonaVie from a site like this. In fact, it’s so bad for MLM businesses that they resort to tactics like: MonaVie Gaming Google to “Combat Negativity” and “Manage what People See on the Internet”. It clearly can’t be better for such companies.

    You are right that it is better to know what you are up against before taking on a business venture. That’s why sites like these are necessary. They give you the information that you don’t get from anyone associated with an MLM.

    As for the efficacy of health juices, they are simply that, health juices. It turns out that MonaVie is one serving of fruit just like any other 100% fruit juice. If you read that article, you’ll learn that juice is less preferable to actual fruit since it doesn’t contain fiber. Those who cannot take that much sugar can simply drink less of any juice – or eat fruit, where the fiber is beneficial to the sugar intake.

    I agree with you, it doesn’t make much sense to mention nutrition along side a juice. However, that is MonaVie’s pitch, so I have to address it. Even yourself made a mention of “the efficacy of health juices”, so it sounds like you would be wrong to back-peddle and then say that nutrition and juice doesn’t make sense.

    Please don’t make MonaVie about something you believe in or not. It’s not religion. It isn’t about belief. It’s simple fruit juice, no different than anything else you can get in most grocery stores.

  10. Yosef Katz Says:

    Hehe, now you have really cut into my belief system! Because I believe that juice loses most of its quality after a few minutes after it has been squeezed no matter what process it undergoes. I do believe, however, it is better to drink even that juice then nothing as most people do not drink enough.

    So eat fresh fruits and drink lots of water!

    As for business and marketing I believe anything is viable to market as long as the end consumer sees enough value in it to continue to buy and utilize it. There are so many products in the market that cover many spectrum’s that are way over valued (not only health and skin and beauty and so forth but real food products as well) that consumers continue to buy regularly, and that creates the market.

    One can argue that as long as someone is selling something like that…but I believe the ultimate responsibility should be with the consumer as I “have never eaten anything accidentally” – Zig Ziglar on being overweight “on purpose”.

    So eat fresh fruits (and vegetables) and drink lots of water!

  11. Speak Your Truth Says:

    Yasef Katz says: “No one is convinced not to do an MLM/Network Marketing program from sites like this. It is actually better for the business, as those who join join with a more open perspective.”

    You think MV is spending TIME and MONEY on trying to control others on which sites; to NOT go to or even click on; is because they believe it “betters their business.” That is flat out histerical!

    You are self-deceived and the ONLY one to believe that lie.

    Thanks for the laughs! :)

  12. Yosef Katz Says:

    Somehow it seems you and most of the haters of MLM out there got it in there head that what an MLM company really seeks and needs to build their business strong is a bunch of stupid blathering idiots running around wildly selling their products!

    The truth can be no further away!

    As for the viability of MLM/Network Marketing products vs that of say Proctor & Gamble it seems to come down to personal choice.

    The ultimate network marketing company built on the ultimate marketing team would be a team made up of committed leaders, dedicated to market the products using the system. They would purchase and sell a small amount of products every month, and use them as well, be a product of the product so to speak and get a few do to the same, every single one of them! Anything other then that is hype and fiction including anti scare or scare tactics either way.

    People don’t buy or not buy a juice that a friend recommends because they read some article online that ways it has worth or is worthless, it just doesn’t matter that much to them.

    If they try it, and they like it and want more, they buy it and keep buying it until they are either committed to it or lose interest. And people that spend a few hundred dollars and consume a product typically do not whine that they were beguiled and that they found out later the product had no value! Most of them could care less and go on with life.

    As for MV, well they might be stuck in a holding pattern, or some of their top distributors who have money to blow might think they need to protect the brand image so it looks like MV is spending dollars to that effect or maybe even they are and will suffer that loss, who cares? Do people jump on every local ad campaign of conventional business that fails or not (P&G?), I think not, again they mostly could care less.

    If you laugh too much I’ll have to have my agent bill you! Be well all. Eat fresh fruits and vegetables and drink a lot of clean water!

  13. Yosef Katz Says:

    Corrections to post as there is no edit ability here:

    there head –> their head
    that ways it has –> that says it has


  14. MadScientistMatt Says:

    Yousef says: “Somehow it seems you and most of the haters of MLM out there got it in there head that what an MLM company really seeks and needs to build their business strong is a bunch of stupid blathering idiots running around wildly selling their products!”

    The biggest reason “haters of MLM” have that impression is the abject failure of many MLMs to weed out said stupid blathering idiots. Ever see MonaVie send a message to their distributors along the lines of, “We caught so-and-so using illegal medical claims and other FTC violations to sell our product. He is now an ex-distributor and we are suing him for the damage he did to our reputation. Don’t let this happen to you – here’s a copy of the rules, and we want you to play by them.”

    A company that wants to get rid of sleazy salespeople would make them object lessons, not Black Diamonds. A company that wants quality salespeople would be selective about whom it hires and provide them with training at its own expense to properly develop them. This does not describe the majority of MLMs.

  15. Yosef Katz Says:

    Hm, interesting, I am not in the juice business, however, please humble me and show me one Black Diamond that can or could be found making outrageous product claims. I highly doubt any evidence of that is available, I have seen what kind of tempering goes into producing a leader of that caliber!

    As for haters I am quite convinced they will find something else to hate at the blink of an eye, especially if the MLM/Network Marketing concept never existed.

    Take care all.

  16. Speak Your Truth Says:

    “Somehow it seems you and most of the haters of MLM out there got it in there head that what an MLM company really seeks and needs to build their business strong is a bunch of stupid blathering idiots running around wildly selling their products!”

    Funny when we built an MLM to tens of thousands of people and had it stolen by your ‘the honest MLM’ers’ we never once were called haters, until we exposed the corruption and lies? Matter of fact they loved us bringing those kind of numbers.

    What do you do before you sign someone up in your group, do you have a ‘stupid test’ that you either reject or take? How many have you refused to sign up because they were ‘stupid’?

    You have NO one fooled here with your perfect theoretical business building BS, and you know it.

    How much juice you sold for $40 a crack because ‘someone’ liked it there, Yosef who are legitimate customers, without signing them up, after your stupid test of course?

    You have learned the diversions and spinning techinques well, you should try being more honest next time about how the MLM business are really built. So, now you are admitting MV is stuck in a holding pattern. Which is it, it helps their business or they have money to blow?

    Why are you here again, I must have missed that? :) What MLM are you with?

  17. Yosef Katz Says:

    @Speak Your Truth – Thank you much! That really puts things into perspective. You are upset because you built a large organization which was then stolen. That must really hurt and I understand what that means as I have seen it a few times on a major scale.

    Please forgive me for labeling anyone here as a simple “hater” of MLM. It is obvious you have great skill (unless you got really really lucky which I doubt) in the busines or had at least and if not for your unfortunate event you may still be enjoying that success today.

    Yes, I understand that the business does not build in the perfect model, but only the perfection in the business ends up making any difference, even if it is scattered.

    I have never sold anything to anyone without making sure they wanted to consume it. And if they complained about not liking it I always assisted them to do the product return, I know I am an exception and it used a lot of my time.

    Yeah, I am not entirely sure about MV, I would need more specific data, could be a bit of both.

    I am here because I was searching on an unrelated legal issue which I wanted clarification on and I am in the business (not MV) and enjoy this thread as it offers some insight, especially now that you have given open clarification on your position, thank you for that.

    As for my business it is not related to MV or this thread but to Network Marketing in general so will not tie up your thread with that if you care to do some searching you will find it.

    Be well.

  18. Speak Your Truth Says:

    Yosef Katz~ What business MLM are you with? Appreciate your understanding but don’t think it will change a thing for what you say.

    You really didn’t just try and insult with your question to “show you one Black Diamond that can or could be found making outrageous product claims”; did you? You still are playing games, Yosef.

    I am sure JS could point to a lot of outrageous product claims, I don’t follow that and will leave that for him.

    But I do know this for you to ask a question like that; is nothing but you trying insult and playing games. Anyone knows there won’t be many if any Black Diamonds who will alow themselves to get caught saying much of anything, that is what makes me ill about the misleaders I know, they accept no responsiblity for what they pass down but sit make and rake in millions off those they use to do their dirty work. You are not talking to the average ‘quitter’ who didn’t build it, I have seen all the corruption I ever care to see!

    That’s what they use their loyal ‘followers’ for! The information is passed down from the top, they have a lot of read between the lines speeches, and implying BS from stage to get the point across to the gullable, naive ones that get wrapped up in the emotion and just repeat what they hear like brainwashed followers, with their hyperbole fanatasism, then behind the scenes, the leaders get the real messages and use the whisper campaigns.

    Something is not right here Yasef calling everyone MLM haters, and then change to you came here for an unrelated legal issue.

    What would that unrelated legal issue be?

  19. Yosef Katz Says:

    ok, and this will be my final post as this way off topic. First off I did enjoy reading the initial post here and it did offer insights, and since then I have read a few other posts on this blog that help me as well. Secondly I did not call everyone an MLM hater, please re-read if you need to. Thirdly misled people do not build strong organizations, you have said you built at least one, you couldn’t be one of the misled that you speak of. And I just searched my search history on my browser and actually do not remember what I was searching for that got me here, perhaps the blog owner can lookup my ip address and see as it was a search result from Google, I don’t mind him posting it here. I look up many many issues, both legal, marketing, tech and yoga related in the course of my personal browsing (BTW did you know centos 6 was released this month?), please do not try to feel paranoid because I ended up on this blog! I am sure the blog owner won’t.

    I did not attempt to insult anyone so please do not take it that way. If you don’t like the way I worded it, that is fine but I meant no harm.

    So please eat fresh fruits and vegetables, work out some (whatever exercise you like), and drink a lot of clean water.

    Be well.

  20. Speak Your Truth Says:

    Yosef~ Only want to address a couple last things you say:
    “Secondly I did not call everyone an MLM hater, please re-read if you need to.

    ” You didn’t need to call EVERYONE a hater. You were speaking to me and said MOST others according to your words. Your attitude was enough, You made your point. This is a very standard attitude and common response; just go through all the posts and you will find this to be true.

    Last thing you said “Thirdly misled people do not build strong organizations, you have said you built at least one, you couldn’t be one of the misled that you speak of.”

    I beg to differ.You obviously haven’t studied anything on undue influence, mind control, or brainwashing. I challenge you, so you can understand how someone can be deceived and therefore deceive others mostly without them knowing it and keeping them ‘disoriented’.

    I recommend you read Merchants of Deception, that should give you a good glimse into our world, read Freedom of Mind & Rick Ross website,Pyramid Scheme Alert site, Corporate Fraud Watch, Read books by Lifton and Singer, Read the rest of this site,check out Amthrax blog and you will then begin to be more educated and get a jest of the illusion and web of deceit, cult jargon, stop thinking techniques, deception, and how even the most intelligent people can be deceived and deceive others with the crafty MLM and ‘leadership training’; that we have experienced. Who also use diverson techniques, to keep the facts of the an already complex, inaccurate IDS; as an after thought.

    We have taken responsiblity for those we have mis-lead and have made as many apologies has we could, I owe you nothing, but I beg to differ with your comments, we spent a decade and half believing these people who were supposedly our ‘best friends’, were ‘honest’, had ‘integrity’; and as it turns out we were blinded, deceived, major betrayal, lies, and theft occured that is when the light bulb went on so to speak.The rest should be obvious, we stood up to the corruption that we could finally see and they needed to protect their millions.

    So you could say we were deceived therefore deceived others that would be more accurate, your statement is based on what you don’t know about mind control,undue influence, and brainwashing, therefore you are ignorant; and you don’t have a clue.
    Happy Studying. :)

    And yes I agree this has gotten way off topic.

    My apologies to the site owner.

  21. MadScientistMatt Says:

    Hello Yosef,

    In reply to:

    “Hm, interesting, I am not in the juice business, however, please humble me and show me one Black Diamond that can or could be found making outrageous product claims. I highly doubt any evidence of that is available, I have seen what kind of tempering goes into producing a leader of that caliber!”

    Well, you’ve come to the right page to see what sort of tempering MonaVie’s leaders have. One good example is an Emerald, not a Black Diamond, but see this page on Mitch Biggs’s claims. I don’t recall if Emerald is higher or lower than Black Diamond, but he’s high enough they shouldn’t let him get away with that.

  22. Jim Says:

    Yosef, I would also like to direct you to the following video featuring Brig Hart. His interview with individuals begins at 3:10 and again at 4:20. In this video Brig interviews people who claim to have experienced relief from:High blood pressure, Fibromyalgia, diabetes, insomnia, stroke, Bels Palsey, cancer, relief of cronic back pain in only 3 days (which Brit claims he experienced also), and the ability to cease prescription drugs such as Xanax. While it is the individuals making most of these claims, never once does Mr. Hart clairfy for the audience that this juice is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease, the disclaimer required by the FDA in regards to supplements such as Mona vie. By parading these testimonials, and his response of being impressed by the results, is he not endorsing these testimonials?

    Another example would be Black Diamond Jason Lyons’ videos of “Dr.” Lou Niles, who is not nor ever was an MD, who dressed in medical scrubs claims to be an end stage cancer specialist who never lost a patient to cancer, the inference being due to Mona vie. These videos and comments are available on this site as well as Mr. Niles history including a conviction and dishonorable discharge for rape and a subsequent arrest for child touching.

    There are several other examples of high ranking distributors claiming pain relief and medical benefits, but the above are just 2 examples. It appears that some executives inside Mona vie who understand the dangers of making these claims themselves have chosen to let others make the claims. To me this clearly represents an endorsement of these claims, although just a technicality.

    I hope you chose to return and comment on this response to your challenge. Thanks.

    Here’s Brig’s video:

  23. Yosef Katz Says:

    In response to the video I had no idea they were still doing meetings like that in the USA for these juice companies. Not sure why they are not being investigated, always makes me cringe when they do those tent house meetings like that! When I joined a previous supplement company I was pleasantly surprised that none of the presentations had that sort of testimony and so forth. And the company I am with now I hope will be like that as well. Thanks for the answer to my challenge!

    I would have to add that drinking the juice and believing it has benefit is one thing (whether true or not, there are other products out there that claim value that also have much different value then what they claim) but when you have a pressure sales meeting, highly emotional where people are coerced or scared into using a product it is no longer an individual thing.

    I believe a good antioxidant can have a positive benefit on a person, I am not sure, however, how long that benefit will continue without proper exercise and better diet (and more clean water!). Thanks again!

  24. Jim Says:

    Yosef, if you think that was “highly emotional”, you should see the videos of the group baptisms (literally) at the meetings.

    You seem like a good guy and I’m glad you’re searching site’s like this. I hope you’ll continue to research. There are some very serious concerns regarding endless recruitment product based pyramid schemes. Keep seaching brother. The truth will set you free… but it will piss you off first.

  25. Yosef Katz Says:


    I have built several MLM Organizations and the worst of it that I can see is that there are still product users that order after many years when the recruitment and business pushing has stopped. I understand there are great builders on here that feel they did wrong to humanity for learning that skill, whatever. Perhaps the products they sold or the companies they did it for had issues, most do, it just matters to what extent. I sent my resignation to Usana not too long ago as I really do not like the directions their management are taking under the new CEO, and I consider Usana to be best of the best when it comes to product and management (except for the issue that they are publicly held which makes any decent company act like insane, from policies!).

    As for you guys on this board who let out your anger and skillfully attack all anonymously it seems at times ok to me. And at other times it seems similar to the recent cowardly acts that took place in Norway, only you guys are not shooting or blowing up anything, read this and see if you agree:

    So before you blast too long and too hard in your “attempt to bring out the truth” make sure you keep yourself, your mind and you bodies healthy. Eat fresh fruits and vegetables and drink more clean water!

    Yosef Katz

  26. Vogel Says:

    Yosef said: “As for you guys on this board who let out your anger and skillfully attack all anonymously it seems at times ok to me. And at other times it seems similar to the recent cowardly acts that took place in Norway, only you guys are not shooting or blowing up anything, read this and see if you agree:”

    Are you out of your F-ing mind?

  27. Speak Your Truth Says:


    Did you resign from Usana, (isn’t that where Dalin came from, thought so) maybe you remember him from there? Is that where you plan on raiding your downline; and taking it over to MV or what is your next hop?

    You said; Listen,

    “I have built several MLM Organizations and the worst of it that I can see is that there are still product users that order after many years when the recruitment and business pushing has stopped.”

    Seriously? The worst of it is just others still buying products after the pushing stops?

    You are NOT that naive after building several MLM’s.

    We won’t even go into the build & replace, or perhaps you really only built one and hopped from one to the other with your existing one?

    But how have you Failed to SEE; that lives are destroyed, finances are ruined, marriages taxed,friendships ruined, time and money is robbed from the 99% etc, that won’t ever make a profit, but believe they will, because they are coerced with lifestyle’s of the rich; to believe they will? Let me guess none of that happened in any of the SEVERAL of MLM’s you have been a part of?

    You say “I understand there are great builders on here that feel they did wrong to humanity for learning that skill, whatever.”

    WHATEVER? Really, what skill is that; ‘hurting humanity’? Your ok with hurting humanity? Explains why you are a MLM’er.

    The problem is you can’t or won’t SEE the damage.

    No amount of money is worth destroying lives. Do your research, take that challenge.

    It has NOTHING to do with eating fresh fruits & vegetables and getting plenty of clean water.

    Might want to go back and read what your posts said from the start before you make your statements about others as if we are some kind of rebel hate group.

  28. CGC Says:


    Your Norway shooter analogy is totally inappropriate. And oh, Tim Sales is a simpleton douchebag.

  29. Yosef Katz Says:


    I will comment as it seems to be getting back on topic and I want to make sure I respect the blog and not get off on tangents!

    It has been quite some time since Dallin Larsen was in Usana. His mother and other brother run a very successful Usana business and have for many years. Dallin Larsen, on the other hand, seems like kind of a black sheep of the family! And if you follow previous comments (in this post) and the audio recording of him doing Royal Tongan Limu (which was shut down by the FDA!) you’ll get a feeling for that, though he is quite dynamic to say the least!

    As for me, and MV, as I said before, I don’t do MV, or any other juice program. Also, I have never raided any downline or even taken my own with me when I moved from one company to the next. I prefer to build from scratch, it begins a bit slower but has a better long term effect. You would see that if you had done any research about me, as I do NOT remain anonymous like most of you!

    Thank you for your comments, be well, and yes you should eat fresh fruits and vegetables and drink more clean water, yes yes yes you should!


  30. Vogel Says:

    Yosef, you lost all credibility when you likened the people who post here to a Norwegian mass murderer.

    F-ing idiot!

    You can go back to hustling your BS vitamins now.

  31. Yosef Katz Says:

    Vogel, you seem to enjoy venting your anonymous anger! How do we know you are not the next in line to do some heinous social act like that? Perhaps people and agencies should watch more carefully! We seem to have touched a nerve with that and you, after all I did not write the CNN article, I just think the kind of anger you guys express is similar, cool in nature, to what that guy had in his manifesto…though you are speaking of different subjects.

    Be well…and you know the drill but I’ll restate, eat fresh fruits and vegetables and drink more clean water.

    This is the last time I will answer here off topic, my apologies to the sysop.


  32. Vogel Says:

    Once again Yosef, when you liken the comments here about a fraudulent fruit juice company with the actions of a Nordic white supremacist mass murderer, you show yourself to be a an utter moron and an insensitive jackass.

    Take one of those vegetables and ram it where the sun don’t shine. Have a nice day and God bless :)

  33. MonaVie Scam Says:


    I think you should stop commenting while you are behind. MonaVie distributors have threatened my life… that’s why I, and others, remain anonymous. Given all the information about MonaVie on this website, you have to have some kind of mental imbalance to get involved with the company. I would be much more worried about those people being mass murderers than a bunch of people who are volunteering their time and energy to educating the public and protect them from getting scammed.

  34. humiliated Says:

    I really don’t like giving this pathetic, MLM pusher any more of our energy, ON or OFF topic (BTW, you don’t come on here, insult the hell out of people, minimize a tragedy, then call it “talking off topic”, you sick bastard) but I must say, the ONE thing that you ought to have done Yosef, is apologize for your disturbing remarks. The fact that you think that this is an appropriate way to argue this issue, really does make me wonder if you aren’t due for your (what I am sure is an annual) psychological assessment.

    Vogel, Juice Scam and the rest of us are very passionate about protecting the public from people like you, and your industry. We have seen people come on here with a passion matching ours in defence of the magic “juice” or the magic “vitamin supplement” industry. It has NEVER, not ONCE occured to myself or anyone blogging on this to liken these people
    to mass murderers. It is people like you that actually make me want to fight harder against your kind & these scams.

    You are a sick, sick man.

  35. Yosef Katz Says:

    Anger is like fire, a little does a little damage, a lot does more and so on…

    I of course did not liken anyone to mass murderers, but the anger that is readily displayed here is similar, in my opinion, in tone, to that of a recent mass murderers’ tone. If you feel deeply about that then it just might be time for you to look inside.

    Eat fresh fruits and vegetables, drink more clean water!


    ps – My apologies to the sysop for posting again, I am trying to lay off but if it is direct and not true I feel I should answer it.

  36. humiliated Says:

    Yosef. Please stop talking in circles. You made an entirely inappropriate comment and you refuse to back away from it. ANY reference to the recent tragedy in this context is revolting and you need to (yet refuse to) atone for this.

    Yes, there are certain things that I get angry about, I will admit it. If we didn’t get angry and stand up for what we believe in (in a non-violent way) social justice would never be served. I believe that commercial cults like USANA and MONAVIE are destroying people’s lives and I will fight to help end them. We all have to believe in something, right? You believe in ripping innocent people off, I think you need to look inside and see what compels you to do that.

  37. MonaVie Scam Says:


    If anger is like fire then we can agree than when directed appropriately it is a tool. We’ve seen this in stove tops, blow torches, even the combustible engine. There’s a reason why fire is the most important thing to get on the episode of Survivor.

    If you are a victim of such law breaking practices, it is reasonable to be angry at those who victimize you. In fact, it’s a typical emotion present in many, perhaps all mammals. Don’t believe me? Try teasing a hungry, uncared for pit bull. You’ll quickly get a lesson in anger.

    There are no real threats of violence on this site which is where your analogy goes way off the deep end. Well there was one – MonaVie Distributor Glenn Siesser who Threatened to Kill Me.

    The lesson here is that you can’t generalize fire and anger to be bad.

    You also can’t suggest that the anger here is similar to that anger and then say, “If you feel deeply about that then it just might be time for you to look inside.” If you compare people to mass murders they are probably to going to have deep feelings about that. That goes for any and everyone. It doesn’t mean it’s time to look inside. It means that you are so far off the mark that it doesn’t make any sense.

    Since you seem to want to directly answer questions, why don’t you focus on this article and the points made in it comparing MonaVie and Napster?

  38. Mackwiz Says:

    Wow. I see I missed much in my short absence. So now we have the same “tone” as a right wing terrorist. I’ve seen a lot a ridiculous claims from MLM peddlers but comparing angry MLM critics to terrorists takes the cake.

    Just because we are angry at Yosef’s support for MLM scammers (I know not all MLM’s are scams, but in all honesty I think they are all a stupid way to try and make money) we are now evil, nigh on mudering, people.

    Yosef, your little holier than thou, pompous jerk attitude is asinine. You are not fooling anyone here with your insipid little fake display of goodwill.

    “Eat fresh fruits and vegetables, drink more clean water!”

    So why argue about stupid MLM juice in the first place?

  39. Jeff Flanagan Says:

    I enjoy fat smokers that tell me it’s a scam..or’ “im good”…yeah, right!…my golf partner, a 68 yr.old doctor buys it from me, and drinks it daily…must be a scam!!

  40. Mackwiz Says:

    What does being fat and smoking have to do with an MLM scam product? I have seen “fat smoker” distributors so what exactly are you implying?

  41. jim Says:

    Jeff, are you implying doctors can’t be scammed? Were their any doctors that were scammed by Madoff? Or are you implying professionals in a given field can’t be scammed? There were pension funds and professional investors scammed by Madoff. Even smart people fall for scams.

    The problem is, first, anyone can make a claim. I could claim Obama and Rush Limbaugh play shuffleboard with me every Wednesday and drink Taitian Noni until we’re giddy with Noni-goodness.

    Second, we don’t know what type of doctor your claimed friend is…is he a Chiropractor, a Naturopath, a Homeopath, an MD, what are his credentials, etc. If he is a legit doctor, and not a quack, I’d suggest he come on here, give us his name, where he practices, why he drinks and/or recommends mona vie. In all the years on this site and Lazyman, I can not recall a single legitimate doctor who is willing to put his reputation on the line defending the benefits of this product.

  42. Mary Says:

    Hi, I’m Mary. Let’s all stay informed and love eachother. All the good sense in the world is no good if we automatically start insulting those with other opinions. Abraham Lincoln said “I don’t like that man. I must get to know him better.” I think this is all a misunderstanding and I just hated all the name calling happening here. Anyway, the fruit, veggie and water reminders did seem to be a bit….patronizing. Play nice y’all.

  43. MonaVie Scam Says:


    This is website is to help inform one another.

    There’s really no sense in having opinions in the case of something like MonaVie that can and has been tested and is shown to have little nutritional benefit – Well, you can have “other opinions”, but it is like having the opinion that the world is flat. When you have an opinion that opposes what has been scientifically shown with no evidence or reasoning behind your opinion, it just doesn’t reflect well on your intelligence.

    If it is a misunderstanding, MonaVie is welcome to help clear it up in a public forum. That’s what any reputable company would do. I have been asking them to do it for years and they haven’t.

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