MonaVie and the Placebo Effect |
67 Comments |
There are times where people will give a testimony that MonaVie helped them with [medical condition X]. I assert that it is really impossible to tell if MonaVie did that for the individual. If you are being open-minded about MonaVie, you know that other explanations are possible. Perhaps a change in weather made a difference. Perhaps a less stressful life helped. It’s really hard to say, but I’d say that the best explanation is the placebo effect. Here’s what Wikipedia has to say on the Placebo Effect:
“A placebo is a sham medical intervention. In one common placebo procedure, a patient is given an inert sugar pill, told that it may improve his/her condition, but not told that it is in fact inert. Such an intervention may cause the patient to believe the treatment will change his/her condition; and this belief does indeed sometimes have a therapeutic effect, causing the patient’s condition to improve. This phenomenon is known as the placebo effect.”
I added the bolding myself for emphasis. If the power of positive thinking can have a proven therapeutic effect, it is reasonable to assert that drinkers of MonaVie may be experiencing this. Why might people think MonaVie would improve his/her condition? I can think of three reasons (there may be more):
- Distributors or the Internet say is does – You can search Google and find tons of references of MonaVie being linked to supposedly helping people with autism. These are unverifiable claims that may be added by distributors to help sell their product.
- MonaVie’s serving size is medicine-sized – People are used to taking medicine in doses of 1 ounce or less. People drink juices in serving sizes of 8 ounces or more. MonaVie’s juice is in a 1 ounce serving size increasing it’s similarity to juice. You’ll never hear anyone talk about drinking MonaVie as a thirst-quenching beverage like any other juice.
- Distirbutors use language like “taking” MonaVie – You’ll hear people say all the time that they “take” MonaVie in the morning and night. You “take” pills and medicine – not juice. No one says that they “take” a glass of orange juice at night time. You drink juice. Listen for when people say that they are taking MonaVie and you can spot that they may be subtly trying to trick you (or they are unaware that they’ve been tricked themselves) that it’s medicine.
It’s also worth noting that’s an additional placebo effect here… the Price-Placebo Effect. Scientists have shown that people perceive a product to have more value when they pay more for it. They not only think that, but the product seems to “work” more because of it. In fact, people told they were spending more money for a energy drink actually performed better on mental tasks.
So we see here that there are two reasons why MonaVie may appear to provide some kind of benefit to a person – without physically providing it. Some may say that it’s irrelevant, they just want the benefit. I understand that line of thinking, but realize that placebos can be had cheaply. If you really want the Price-Placebo effect, you should buy your placebos from a friend at a high price and sell him yours at the same high price.
It is well-worth noting that one can’t argue it’s not the placebo effect as it works subconsciously. They simply can’t know what’s in their subconscious as that is the very definition of subconscious. So if someone says that they know their body and MonaVie helped it and it wasn’t the placebo effect (as I’ve seen numerous times), you know that they really don’t understand the placebo effect and how it works.
Frequent commenter, Vogel adds a great point:
“We should also bear in mind that this is not just a typical placebo effect situation, but rather one in which there are tangible rewards for believing that Monavie acts like a drug (e.g., group acceptance, better sales, greater profit) and clear disadvantages to not believing (group ostracism, reduced ability to sell the product convincingly, etc.). In other words, the placebo effect is being strongly coerced.”
Update: Some claim that it’s not possible for a placebo to have the effects that they are seeing on people. Those people would be flat out wrong.
Non-alcoholic beer can make people act drunk
Did you know that the placebo effect can make people act like they are drunk when they haven’t had any alcohol? It’s true… see this Victoria University study. Here are a few quotes:
“We found people who thought they were intoxicated were more suggestible and made worse eyewitnesses compared with those who thought they were sober,” Seema Assefi says.
“In fact the ‘vodka and tonic’ students acted drunk, some even showing physical signs of intoxication,” she adds.
and:
When told, the sober students reacted with disbelief.
“When students were told the true nature of the experiment at the completion of the study, many were amazed that they had only received plain tonic, insisting that they had felt drunk at the time,” she comments.
Dr Garry concludes: “It showed that even thinking you’ve been drinking affects your behaviour.
Clearly it is quite possible that the people making MonaVie testimonies are like the drunken students insisting that they feel something that clearly isn’t there.
There’s also the famous non-alcoholic keg party prank that Princeton pulled that duplicated the effects:
Update : I read an article here that the placebo effect even helps those who know it is a placebo. I’m not sure how that plays into things, I just found it interesting.
The above article is intended to be accurate at the time of its original posting. MonaVie may change its pricing, product, or other policies at any time without notice.This post involves:
monavie, placebo
... and focuses on:MonaVie & Medicine
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Next: MonaVie, FTC Guidelines, and Distributor Testimonies
November 29th, 2009 at 10:15 am
Perception is reality even if it is not reality in actuality.
March 24th, 2010 at 12:34 am
Try arguing against double-blind placebo tests.
March 24th, 2010 at 6:11 am
Show me a double-blind placebo test where MonaVie was shown to have medicinal benefits.
April 7th, 2010 at 6:45 am
its been 2 weeks anon, where are the double blind tests you speak of??? hmmmmmmmmmmm. do you also sleep under a magnet blanket?
April 14th, 2010 at 11:52 am
MonaVie Active Clinical Study
1. In a double-blind, placebo controlled, crossover clinical study, subjects taking MonaVie Active—which contains a blend of 19 fruits, including açai—had a significant increase in their antioxidant capacity and inhibition of lipid peroxidation.
2. Fats like cholesterol circulating in the blood stream are easily oxidized by free radicals. This is called lipid peroxidation. Lipid peroxidation has been shown to be damaging to the circulatory system. Studies have shown that reduction of lipid peroxidation has been associated with improved cardiovascular well-being.
3. 83.3% of study participants had a statistically significant increase (relative to placebo) in antioxidant activity within their cells.
4. This study also supports that drinking 4 ounces of MonaVie Active daily helps increase the antioxidant capacity in the body.
Note: This study was conducted in a relatively small number of healthy adults. Further studies with larger sample sizes are needed before these results can be generalized to the population-at-large.
April 14th, 2010 at 11:56 am
MonaVie Active Structure/Function Claims (Glucosamine)
1. MonaVie Active contains the additional benefits of glucosamine, a natural substance found in healthy joint cartilage.
2. Glucosamine helps build glycoproteins, glycosaminoglycans and proteoglycans, which are essential to making and maintaining healthy connective tissue and joint cartilage.
3. Glucosamine, when taken regularly at 1500mg per day, may help maintain healthy joint function and improve joint comfort.
4. Glucosamine, when taken regularly at 1500 mg per day may help with minor aches and pains associated with post exercise recovery.
April 14th, 2010 at 1:42 pm
How much glucosamine is in MonaVie Active? I only see claims of what glucosamine “may” do at 1500 mg per day, but no information as to if MonaVie has that.
However, I can be assured of getting 95 days of 1500mg of glucosamine for $28 here on Amazon. That makes glucosamine retail for about $0.30 per 1500mg. If we make the assumption that MonaVie’s recommended amount of 4 ounces a day has 1500mg (huge assumption, but I don’t know what else to go on) at the retail price for Active it is $7.20 per 1500mg of glucosamine.
This shouldn’t be surprising because I found all the MonaVie Pulse Structure/Functio Claims (Plant Sterols) can be made by a pill that costs 7 cents. It’s clear that MonaVie is just taking these very cheap additives and using them so that distributors and marketing can make seemingly convincing claims like Pearman 7 listed above. Sadly they fall apart when you just scratch the surface.
I won’t even bring up that there are conflicting studies on the efficacy of glucosamine and studies mentioned here. Oh wait I just did.
April 14th, 2010 at 1:50 pm
The MonaVie Active Clinical Study, it didn’t show any medicinal benefit can be had by MonaVie. I thoroughly debunk this study on 9/28/2008 in comment 974 here: http://www.lazymanandmoney.com/monaVieArchive.php. At some point I will do so more formally here, but I have been busy.
For those too lazy to click the summary of it was that the juice didn’t have a base that included eating a normal amount of recommended fruit. Thus they were comparing people who eat no fruit and had no sources of antioxidants to people who have drank some (MonaVie). The same or even better results could have been had by a small amount of vitamin C. MonaVie has to prove more than “it’s better than nothing” to justify being priced 10 to 20 times as much as other juices. It needs to prove that it is 10 to 20 times more effective than other juices. Men’s Journal has commissioned an independent lab and MonaVie came back worse than the cheaper juices in just about every way: http://www.juicescam.com/mens-journal-proves-monavie-lacks-nutrition/
April 14th, 2010 at 2:56 pm
Look Pearman, you dipshit, since you can’t make an argument for yourself and you have to rely on Monavie brochures, which we’ve all seen and discounted already, at least have the sense to just post the link instead of cutting and pasting reams of crap.
July 24th, 2010 at 10:03 am
You guys are arguing for no good reason. The fact is the product is amazing I know over 50 people personally that drink it and our lives have changed. The integrity of the company is amazing and they have put in the scientific work. If you cant find these results its your own fault. Why beat up a product that works if you choose not to drink it and you can get something cheaper then by all means get whatever you want but why such a desire to try to make Monavie look like something fake. If it helps people that have not had relief anywhere else then so be it leave them alone.
July 24th, 2010 at 4:24 pm
I know over 100 people who have had their lives ruined by MonaVie. See what I did there, plafon?
The integrity of the company is obviously not amazing as this site shows. The scientific work is full of holes.
I beat up the product because it doesn’t work. It doesn’t even quench thirst. As you can see in the article above it is an expensive placebo.
July 25th, 2010 at 5:46 pm
Your obviously delusional. Monavie cannot ruin someones life regardless whether they felt or saw results its only whole food and cannot hurt or ruin anyones life. I will not waste time and energy here. I personally know several black diamonds in Monavie and have seen and heard about every positive and negative there is about the company. You can say whatever you want to … but it changes nothing. The company and product is amazing and it will continue to grow whether your hilarious and delusional comments continue on here and regardless of who agrees with you. The science is there whether you know it or not really does not matter. Go to http://www.monavietv.com and look for the Vison 2010 convention clips and watch the scientist speak about it. I am sure you will still be negative because people like you are malicious and really just ignorant but maybe someone else who reads this will be enlightened.
July 25th, 2010 at 7:43 pm
plafon states ” Your obviously delusional. Monavie cannot ruin someones life regardless whether they felt or saw results its only whole food and cannot hurt or ruin anyones life. I will not waste time and energy here. I personally know several black diamonds in Monavie and have seen and heard about every positive and negative there is about the company. You can say whatever you want to … but it changes nothing. The company and product is amazing and it will continue to grow whether your hilarious and delusional comments continue on here and regardless of who agrees with you. The science is there whether you know it or not really does not matter.”
The science is there for sure – Dr Schauss’ own research confirms Monavie has an ORAC of 22.81 and phenolics totalling 175mg. That is, a days serving of Monavie has the nutritional content of less than half an apple.
Perhaps you’re privy to scietific studies that we’re not so please feel free to share these if that’s the case.
How is a company not doing harm to individuals (and their communities) who invest to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars each year on the basis of the blatant misrepresentations concerning the product and after having had vital pieces of information concerning the opportunity withheld from them as at the time of signing up – such as the 99.64% loss rate which is evidenced on the IDS.
Whilst your own distorted views are a product of being enlightened by Monavie propaganda, former Monavie Royal Black Diamond, Kelly Bangert provides a more realistic picture concerning the impact this company has had on his life through his description of his business plummeting throughout 2009 and that of his Blue Diamond’s life who had his house foreclosed on, another Blue Diamond who lost his car and his top leaders who couldn’t even pay their bills.
http://www.mlmwatchdog.com/files/DOCUMENTS/Xowii_v._Monavie.pdf
What’s amazing is there are distributors such as yourself who have the facts available to you but still insist on defending the inconsistencies and misrepresenting the facts yourself – all because you’re DELUDED enough to believe you’re climbing to the top of the pyramid.
July 25th, 2010 at 7:52 pm
Plafon: “The fact is the product is amazing I know over 50 people personally that drink it and our lives have changed.â€
Apparently you don’t know the difference between a FACT and an opinion; your statement was the latter. Is the product so amazing and life changing that you can’t even begin to articulate the reasons why? Did Monavie erase your memory?
Plafon said: “The integrity of the company is amazing and they have put in the scientific work. If you cant find these results its your own fault.â€
Integrity??? ROFL!!! We found dozens of FACTS that show that the integrity of the company couldn’t be much worse. I could run through the list of names and notorious accomplishments of those in the Monavie Hall of Shame, but what would be the point? It won’t stop you from BSing nor cure you of delusional thinking. You would just bury your head in the sand and continue to deny what’s painfully obvious to any rational person.
Plafon said: “If it helps people that have not had relief anywhere else then so be it leave them alone.â€
Relief from what??? Monavie doesn’t even relieve thirst. Helped who??? How??? When you say ‘leave them alone,’ what you really mean is ‘don’t tell the truth’.
Plafon said: “Your obviously delusional. Monavie cannot ruin someones life regardless whether they felt or saw results its only whole food and cannot hurt or ruin anyones life.â€
You failed to grasp the point that ‘Monavie Scam’ was making. It’s no more delusional to say that Monavie has hurt 100 people than it is to blindly assert that it helped 50. And you aren’t thinking clearly; on the one hand you say we’re delusional because we don’t believe your fantasies about Monavie treating diseases, and then on the other, you say that Monavie is just food. You only get to pick one side of an argument. BTW, fruit juice doesn’t change lives — except in Monavie’s case…by ruining them.
Plafon said: “I will not waste time and energy here.
Oh I how I wish that were true, but we’ve heard that line before. Sadly, you’ll probably be back — but it won’t be your time that will be wasted. If you do come back, you should post your name and distributor ID# as required. My guess is you’re far too ashamed to do so.
July 25th, 2010 at 8:01 pm
You are the delusional ones. We’ve seen first-hand people tell their story here. They ended up trying to sell the worthless expensive juice to all their friends and family and ruined their relationships and lead them to financial ruin. Anonymous Aussie, who comments here often, told me one story. Another person emailed me the story you can read here: http://www.lazymanandmoney.com/my-friend-is-brainwashed-by-get-rich-quick-schemes-help/.
You obviously haven’t talked to Black Diamond Kelly Bangert: See exhibit B here: http://www.mlmwatchdog.com/files/DOCUMENTS/Xowii_v._Monavie.pdf.
You can see the proof on this website… there are more than 75 articles that prove that the company and product is not amazing. In fact, not one positive fact has come from MonaVie. Even the charity associated with them, the MORE project misuses donations and doesn’t file required paperwork.
The science is clearly not there… if you read any of the articles on this website, you’d know that it’s not open to interpretation. It’s not opinion… it is logically very shoddy science. If you don’t believe me, believe the reputable doctors: Dr. Andrew Weil (formally in Time Magazine’s top 25 Americans and top 100 people in the world), Dr. Dean Edell, and Dr. Jonny Bowden have spoken out against MonaVie. These are independent doctors who are nationally recognized.
MonaVie’s “science” is contributed by exclusively by people paid by MonaVie. That’s especially true of the scientists on monavietv.com. That should tell you all you really need to know.
Plafon, you are clearly brainwashed like the person I mentioned above. You are quick to use the MonaVie brainwash lingo like calling people negative when they just trying to help not spend $45 for 25 ounces of juice. If you were selling Honda Accords for $200,000 would you be calling me negative for trying to warn people? I’m sure you would. You are quick to call someone ignorant, when you haven’t done the research.
July 26th, 2010 at 7:54 am
Thanks for your comments but I know what it has done for my wife who is a super healthy eater already and it help her pack pain of 5 years and my sister who had back pain hip pain and leg pain who stayed on the couch most of the time is now living actively. My freind with fibromyalgia that was stuck in her house most of the time because of pain now lives an active life at 75 years of age. I could contimue but no point.
Kelly Bangert is still a black diamond and at the convention in June. His story was a bummer but he has rebuilt. Calvin Becerra that was apart of his team was effecting by it as well and has also rebuilt his business.
Dr. Shcauss was around 30 years in scince before MOnavie and would not risk his career on something that was not really what he says it is.
I will use this experience with you to do my homework little more in detail.
We have been blessed by this product and the balck diamonds that have welcomed us intheir homes in NC have been like a second family and they have no reason to welcome us because we are not even a part of their downline. I spent the 4th of July with Brig Hart, Steve Merritt, Charlie Kalb, Bob Robinson, Matt Curtis, Grayson Maule, Brian Thayer, and several blue diamonds. I know these people personally and they hearts for God. I am a christian as well and I have been around the block and I am very analytical. I have seen nothing but pure hearted people since day one.
I do apologize for calling you delusional I was a little upset, I hope you accept my apology.
God bless you in your future endeavors.
July 26th, 2010 at 9:17 am
Plafon,
I see that you are MonaVie distributor… it’s not like you hid that fact with your email address. Please stop spreading illegal medical claims and testimonies.
Kelly Bangert came crawling back after being threatened by MonaVie’s anti-competitive behavior. If he wants to sell both juices, there should be no problem with that. My HomeDepot sells light bulbs from multiple manufacturers.
Dr. Schauss got his degree via mail order from a university that doesn’t require lab work (from what I recall…. there’s more information about that on this site).
It’s interesting that you end with the religious aspect. On my other site, there is significant recent discussion on how they are using religion to make people believe that selling overpriced, nutrition-deficient juice is God’s work. See the recent comments at the bottom of: http://www.lazymanandmoney.com/monavie-scam-was-my-wife-recruited-sell-snake-oil/.
July 26th, 2010 at 9:18 am
Oh and Plafon… please leave your name and distributor ID number as required by: http://monaviemediacenter.com/policies-and-procedures-update—social-media
July 26th, 2010 at 10:04 am
You are the one that asked what it relived and how did it help so i just answered your questions. By the way Kelly Bangert did not crawl back he realized that spliting his team between 2 companies was stupid. He made an honest mistake.
I am so glad you responded in that manner, I feel much better now to what type of person i was dealing with.
Have a great life.
July 26th, 2010 at 10:36 am
hey plafoon
you say and i quote.
“We have been blessed by this product and the balck diamonds that have welcomed us intheir homes in NC have been like a second family and they have no reason to welcome us because we are not even a part of their downline. I spent the 4th of July with Brig Hart, Steve Merritt, Charlie Kalb, Bob Robinson, Matt Curtis, Grayson Maule, Brian Thayer, and several blue diamonds. I know these people personally and they hearts for God. I am a christian as well and I have been around the block and I am very analytical. I have seen nothing but pure hearted people since day one. ”
plafoon,
i was part of monavie for a short while and decided to no longer be part of monavie because i did not like being a monabot. and wasting my money, anyways away from that i just wanted to bring up my expirence in as short of words as possible. my expirence with the whole home welcomming and friends like a second family and such.
before i started my future uplines were super friendly, gave me there numbers to text or call, 2 people in particular( sorry for my poor spelling) was never good at it. anyways when when i joined they were all over me like a fly on shit. and they were nice but they only wanted to talk business with me, and when it came to the business they were willing to go all the way with helping me, but i just couldnt afford to do what was required, and i wasnt willing to do what was asked by what i listened on the cds, like selling my stuff, like tv and such.
when i went to a bonfire promo, i had to be on system and on sot as a requirement to attend, which i was already on system because i was told to in order to get ahead , or else i wont make it in the business. anyways i had to be on standing order ticket,(SOT) and i did and went, was a nice fire, but no one just sat there shooting the shit, and talked normal, everyone talked about business stuff, and then when we all sat down for the fire, they just wanted to hear who we were and and what our goals are, and why we joined. and by the time everyone spoke, the fire was done and time for a 6 hour drive home. anyways at the time i thought it was fun because i was really trying to make it in the business but when i think back it was a wast of time and money.
when i talked to my uplines on the hone or texting, they would avoid any normal talk, just wanted business talk or questions, and so i decided to try in person talk, and none of them wanted to be my real friend, just a business friend if i was going to make them money by buying the over priced juice. and when i couldnt afford to buy the juice anymore, and go to meetings, they noticed and after i stopped recieving text messages and calls from my upline about house meetings and business launch meeting, and quotes from high uplines orrin woodward cds. anyways i realized they wernt my second family they were just opeople wanting to get rich off me, so i put a stop to that after i got more research from this site and others.
when you decide you are ready to retire, if you do, good luck if you make it that high, they wont allow it, look at kelly bangart, stuck there for life.even when his money dropped to almost nothing. you gatta read the site scam put up for you and you will see how he was threatened, once i mentioned i know the truth he stopped talking to me on facebook. i guess he is not allowed to speak the truth hence all th lies.
July 26th, 2010 at 1:17 pm
I see where you are coming from. Thats jsut the thing with me thats different though I have been to black diamonds houses just to chill out .. and they were not even my upline at all so no reason for them to talk business with me anyways. On July 4th we had a blast riding boats and catered food all paid for … We did not talk business not once. I never heard anyone talk business really .. occasional chit chat maybe .. but nothing major. Maybe you were involved with the wrong people. R3Global is amazing and the poeple are top notch.
Have a good day.
July 26th, 2010 at 2:58 pm
down hear it aint that nice, and for me to join a team way out there wouldnt help, cant afford to go out there to see them, and i wouldnt rejoin, not worth my time. or wasting my money, just my opinion
July 26th, 2010 at 4:22 pm
Plafon,
Even if someone asks you what MonaVie relieves or how it helps, you can legally say the things that you said. It is entirely possible that it could be coincidence or placebo effect as mentioned in this article. There’s nothing in MonaVie that has ever been clinically shown to have any medicinal effects as you say. It makes no more sense than me claiming my faucet has magic water that heals people.
Kelly Bangert wouldn’t have to split his team between two juices… he would allow his team more options to sell. They are completely different juices. Someone might like one more than the other, so this would be Kelly being a smarting salesman to have a back-up in case people didn’t like the first option. In the document that I cited earlier you can see that Kelly was clearly penalized by MonaVie, so it’s not an honest mistake. If it was an honest mistake and MonaVie was a reputable company there would not have been penalties.
Plafon, I noticed you responded a few times, but haven’t listed your distributor ID number and name as required by: http://monaviemediacenter.com/policies-and-procedures-update—social-media. I kind request you stay in compliance with your own company when commenting on this site.
However, you spent July 4th is not of consequence here. A drug dealer could have an awesome home too. Michael Vick’s home was awesome, but he was found guilty of illegal dog fighting. Kenneth Lay of Enron had all kinds of money and parties… it doesn’t mean he wasn’t scamming people. It doesn’t make him a good person.
July 27th, 2010 at 7:37 am
Your responses never deal with the point of what is being discussed you comment on small aspects of what is said that has nothing to do with the point of what is being said.
I can and will tell my family and friends experiences and there is nothing illegal about it I have not stated it would do the same for anyone else. And a PLACEBO effect does not last 4 years my friend. So give the placebo crap a rest. Also if you do not understand why it could effect people than you have absolutely no reason to even host this site. YOu use the term medicinal effect all the time… do you realize that every medicine comes from natural resouces and nutritional benefits.
Of course water out of your facucet cannot heal anything … but the proper nutrition absolutely can and thats fact. Ask any one that knows nutrition if you find and eat the right nutrition you can change several problems with your body. Take Monavie out of the picture completely and just research nutrition in general. So for you to make the statement that something nutritional cannot help anyone proves how bias and completely empty your mission on this site is.
What the heck are talking about with Michael Vick … I never said anything about big nice houses and has nothing to do with the point of what i said.
July 27th, 2010 at 7:41 am
Oh and the policy about distributor ID has nothing to do with me commenting on your Blog. This is not a blog I have created and I have never stated on here that I am a distributor and I am not giving anyone contact information or information on how to aquire the product.
July 27th, 2010 at 8:10 am
Plafon,
As far as I can tell three things are being discussed.
1) You wonder July 4th holiday with Black Diamonds enjoying all the pleasantries that were purchased by bilking people out of their hard-earned cash. You heavily implied that MonaVie and it’s Black Diamonds are great people because of this time you spent with them. I was simply saying that you could be treated the same by drug dealers or people who fight dogs. This means that the whole July 4th holiday experience you had is really not relevant to this website… other than to show the extreme amount of money they are bilking out of people.
2) The illegal medical claims you made about your friends and family experiences. (And no you can not tell them… see MonaVie’s only #1 rule of distributor guidelines here: http://monaviemediacenter.com/blogs/5-tips-every-monavie-distributor-needs-to-know-about-the-new-ftc-guidelines/. You can only tell what is “a typical result.” So if you don’t have clinical results that it would do the same for anyone else, you can’t say it. If MonaVie wants to go out and get clinical trials done on fibromyalgia, then you’ll be able to say it. In the meantime, please make yourself aware of the law and abide by it. Don’t hold your breath waiting for MonaVie to do such trials… they’ve had five years and haven’t started.
You completely misunderstand my point about nutrition. Proper nutrition is good for you. However, no juice is approved to prevent, treat, or cure any problem in the body… and no juice can improve on simply eating the fruit itself. MonaVie has to fortify it’s product with vitamins and fiber that are typically in fruit because their juice is naturally-deficient in these. Men’s Journal in an independent study proved this: http://www.juicescam.com/mens-journal-proves-monavie-lacks-nutrition/.
So please don’t play that game of nutrition. It’s been played here dozens, if not hundreds of times, and no one can make a claim that MonaVie almost completely void of vitamins, minerals, and fiber is more nutritious than fruit. It’s just modern day Snake oil (see the definition in that link.)
3) Your lack of posting your distributor ID.
The policy strictly states that commenting on any blog about MonaVie (whether selling the product or having created it or otherwise) requires the posting of distributor ID and name. This is specifically so that distributors can’t comment on blogs with illegal health claims as you have done.
Yes, you have not stated you are a distributor, we both know you are. If the FDA or FTC were to come to me about your illegal health claims or your testimonies, I could very easily give them my server logs and show without a doubt that you are breaking the law.
That’s really the point here. You are breaking the law, and claiming that you aren’t because you withheld information that you are a distributor.
And this is the case you make for MonaVie being a reputable business?
July 27th, 2010 at 8:26 am
LOL … you are so full of it. You are hilarious. I never tried to deny I was a ditributor I was simply stating that was not my intent here. MonaVie is very reputable despite what you think. You dont do a billion dollars in 36 months and not be. Find me a MLM company that was not reputable that did that volume.
Good bye I will not return I guarantee you that.
You are as bad as my ex-wife with twisting words and truths.
I find it so hilarious and I am so glad their are people like you because to face persecution means your doing something right. So your persecution of MonaVie only strengthens my faith in it. If they were doing nothing and accomplishing nothing no one would care and there would not be haters.
Bye Bye now.
July 27th, 2010 at 8:26 am
LOL ….. 2216622
July 27th, 2010 at 10:31 am
Glad you finally realized that one of two things had to be true.
1) You are a distributor and not complying with MonaVie’s rules on social media and violating the FTC’s guidelines that MonaVie has specifically asked that you adhere to.
2) You are not a distributor and lying.
It’s too bad it only took you about 8 posts to pick one.
Monavie is a private company. As such there is no reliable information about how much business the company is doing. Plus all business to distributors and not to end-users doesn’t count as retail sales which is the important number. If MonaVie has done a large business, it only reflects poorly on the distributors like yourself who continue to back it. Bernie Madoff’s pyramid scheme also did billions of dollars, so surely we must consider that reputable, right? Enron had more than a billion dollars in business too, so there you go. I’m not going to comment on the failures of other MLM companies. It just shows that MonaVie may be the most successful of a bad model. That’s like putting the best little league baseball player on an all-state high school team… the little league player isn’t really going to be any good.
July 27th, 2010 at 6:24 pm
plafon (ID# 2216622) said: “I can and will tell my family and friends experiences and there is nothing illegal about it I have not stated it would do the same for anyone else. And a PLACEBO effect does not last 4 years my friend. So give the placebo crap a rest.â€
Hey Phillip, I’m going to cut you a break since you at least had enough gumption to post your ID# (albeit after being prodded). Unfortunately, the bad news for you is that I had a look at your Monavie website and found that you are illegally advertising the product using numerous testimonials (including your own and your wife Christine’s) implying that Monavie can treat, prevent, cure and/or mitigate the symptoms of diseases including: sciatica, knee pain, carpal tunnel syndrome, back pain, severe acid reflux, mouth ulcers, digestive track (sic) problems, osteogenesis imperfecta , allergies, high cholesterol, and hypertension.
http://phillipandchristinasstories.blogspot.com
I won’t engage in any argument with you about whether your advertising is illegal — it clearly is. It clearly violates the regulations set forth in the U.S. Code of Federal Regulations (Food & Drug Act) and the terms of your agreement with Monavie, which explicitly forbids you from (a) using testimonials, and (b) using implied medical claims to market the product. Monavie’s distributor training materials make these regulations and policies clear. I can’t imagine that you could be unaware of these regulations and policies, so I have to assume that you willfully chose to ignore them. That doesn’t speak well of your business ethics.
Just to recap, this is what the company says about the use of such testimonials:
“You may not make any claims or personal testimonials that state that MonaVie cures diseases, is therapeutic, is a treatment, mitigates, or is used to diagnose or prevent any disease, illness, or condition. If you say anything like that, not only are you violating MonaVie’s rules, you are also violating laws and regulations in your country.â€
But since you were forthcoming with your ID#, I didn’t file a report with the FDA or notify the company regarding your violations yet. Instead, for now, I’ll give you the opportunity to remove the claims of your own accord, and I certainly hope that after you do remove them, you won’t continue to use such claims covertly offline. Should you choose not to comply, the complaints will be filed. You might also want to make amends with the people you swindled; I’ll leave that up to you.
Fair enough? I’m giving you this opportunity to redeem yourself because maybe, just maybe, you’re a decent enough person to do the right thing. Don’t disappoint me.
July 27th, 2010 at 8:02 pm
Great observations, Vogel!
I can’t help but continue to be disappointed that despite being spoon fed the details concerning the law and company policy which prohibits the use of testimonials such as those posted on Phillip’s site, distributors STILL continue to use these and even defend the use of same!
Phillip – if Monavie was so great, you wouldn’t need to break the law and breach company policy to sell the product. IF anyone you know has thought to have experienced benefits from what is proven to be a nutritionally void fruit juice, it’s in all likelihood because YOU (who is has a vested financial interest in the venture) planted the seed suggestive of it – you know, a placebo effect. Disgraceful.
July 28th, 2010 at 2:17 pm
Hey Phillip, I hope you don’t think I was kidding about reporting you. You have 24 more hours before the axe drops.
July 28th, 2010 at 4:05 pm
I note Phillip’s own testimonial in which he states “Phillip was having trouble sleeping, had lower back pain. knee pain from past basketball injuries, severe acid reflux, mouth ulcers and digestive track problems and after 2 days he was sleeping through the night and his lower back was not hurting as bad. After a week and a half his lower back rarely bothers him. After 4 weeks his digestive track was regulated and after 6 weeks his knee pain went away. Acid reflux rarely arises and all mouth ulcers have disappeared completely.”
There’s nothing contained within Monavie (which is NOTHING more than fruit juice) that would account for the improved of symptoms any of the above conditions and definitely not acid reflux – in fact, it is common knowledge that many fruits and fruit juices aggravate the symptoms of same so it’s more than safe to conclude Phillip’s testimony is absolute bull$hit.
I’d personally like to see not only the axe dropped but a bottle of that Monavie crap dropped on this fraudster’s head – the level of deceit is unbelievable.
July 28th, 2010 at 4:18 pm
i think phillip dug his own grave in the business which may cause his down hill and eventually losing his business.
July 29th, 2010 at 4:48 pm
Yup, bet the bitch thought I was bluffing. Guess what Phil — I just made good on my promise and filed a complaint with the FDA at http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/email/oc/buyonline/buyonlineform.cfm
Here’s a copy just in case you’re curious to know what you’ll be defending yourself against.
—————
Re: Phillip and Christine Lafon
http://phillipandchristinasstories.blogspot.com
Mr. and Mrs. Lafon are distributors of Monavie brand juice who are advertising the product using testimonials that state or imply that it can treat, prevent, cure and/or mitigate the symptoms of diseases including sciatica, knee pain, carpal tunnel syndrome, back pain, severe acid reflux, mouth ulcers, digestive track (sic) problems, osteogenesis imperfecta, allergies, high cholesterol, and hypertension.
These claims clearly promote Monavie (‘Original’, ‘Active’, and ‘Pulse’) for conditions that cause the products to be drugs under section 201(g)(1) of the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act (the Act) [21 U.S.C. § 321(g)(1)].
The distributors in question (Mr. and Mrs. Lafon) have the Monavie distributor identification number 2216622.
They operate the following Monavie sales websites:
http://feelthejuice2.blogspot.com
http://2216622.mymonavie.com
The contact information listed for Mr. Phillip A. Lafon is:
[To respect Phillip's privacy.... I've removed this data... if you want to file a report, please contact me with the "contact" link above.]
feelthejuice2@gmail.com
Monavie LLC can be contacted at:
10855 River Front Parkway,
South Jordan, UT‎
(801) 748-3100‎
(866) 217-8455
compliance@monavie.com
Thank you in advance for your prompt attention to this very serious matter.
July 29th, 2010 at 4:58 pm
Vogel – a review of Phillip’s website confirms he hasn’t removed the illegal (and fraudulent) testimonials.
Looks like an FDA and FTC complaint to me.
July 29th, 2010 at 6:24 pm
I’m with you, Vogel.
My complaints to both the FTC and FDA have also been filed.
July 29th, 2010 at 8:31 pm
I’m kind of glad that he didn’ take it down and get away with fraud. I’d rather see the FDA fry him and the company.
July 30th, 2010 at 9:58 am
It’s now wonder Phillip was keen on discounting the placebo effect issue – his site is filled with illegal disease cure claims which have obviously been his selling point in luring unwitting consumers.
SURELY distributors such as Phillip know they’re doing the wrong thing – there’s just no excuse for any ongoing ignorance.
Unfortunately though, the success of the venture depends on such claims to sell the opportunity and people are obviously prepared to stretch the truth in pursuit of same. The biggest rewards aren’t obtained by telling the truth – the company doesn’t reward for compliance but rather rewards the most lucratively for those who recruit the biggest downline.
July 30th, 2010 at 1:12 pm
He knows now. We spoonfed it to him and he remains unrepentant. I hope the FDA/FTC roasts them all on a spit.
July 30th, 2010 at 6:28 pm
Ok first of all I just now saw what everyone wrote. I was not ignoring you. I said I would not be back is why I did not check if anyone responded. I got a feeling to look tonight and have seen everything posted. I am sorry you all feel the way you do but I am not effected by anything you say however to show you that i do not intend to do anything wrong I will remove my testimonies … I did not post them til the last few weeks anyways. I did not have them there before. Too bad someone filed a complaint, but I am not worried about it. I have removed the testimonies just so you all know. I am not out to anger anyone on purpose.
As far as what I have said it is not un true everything said is 100% true i am not a liar these are all people I know. I am sorry you cant believe it if you study true nutrition and antioxidants you would see that those results are typical. I dont care what you are getting to put it in your body, if you put the nutrition these results are typical. I do not need to say any of that for people to order the product.
You all crack me up! Trust this I will return each year to update you on the success of the company and in ten to twenty years after Monavie is the largest privately held company in the world which, after 5 years are already #18 over all and number #1 in food and beverage and #3 in revenue which is clearly recorded in Inc. Magazine, then I will be delighted to see you all still saying the same things.
July 30th, 2010 at 7:33 pm
After having the message hammered into your head ad nauseum, you’re still utterly oblivious to the fact that you cannot utter such claims in the promotion of the juice; that includes the testimonies on your web page and the claims that you are now making here (i.e., that these miraclulous cures are typical). What a dolt!
But whatever — you’ve been neutered — our mission is accomplished.
July 30th, 2010 at 8:08 pm
Hard to believe that you’d think MonaVie is growing when in fact it is fading: http://www.juicescam.com/interest-in-monavie-is-fading/.
Before you party too much about the Inc. 500 please read the following (and note that Inc. 500 actually commented on the site): http://www.juicescam.com/monavie-and-inc-magazines-500/
July 30th, 2010 at 8:12 pm
Phillip Lafon (ID# 2216622) said: “I was not ignoring you. I said I would not be back is why I did not check if anyone responded.â€
And lo and behold you came back anyway. Stop the BS already Phil!
Phillip Lafon (ID# 2216622) said: “I am sorry you all feel the way you do but I am not effected by anything you say however to show you that i do not intend to do anything wrong I will remove my testimonies.â€
A blatant contradiction! If our comments did not “effect†(sic) you, then you wouldn’t have removed the illegal advertising. And you already knew that these claims were prohibited before we brought them to your attention and threatened to take action. The ONLY reason you ultimately did something about it is because we coerced you with threats.
Phillip Lafon (ID# 2216622) said: “Too bad someone filed a complaint, but I am not worried about it. I have removed the testimonies just so you all know.â€
If you’re not worried then why did you remove the illegal advertising? Put it back on your website if you aren’t worried. I’d actually prefer to see the FDA ream you (and the company as well for enabling you).
Phillip Lafon (ID# 2216622) said: As far as what I have said it is not un true everything said is 100% true i am not a liar these are all people I know. I am sorry you cant believe it if you study true nutrition and antioxidants you would see that those results are typical.
Flaming idiot! It is NOT typical to have fruit juice or antioxidants cure or treat ANY of the diseases you claimed that Monavie can TYPICALLY cure (sciatica, knee pain, carpal tunnel syndrome, back pain, severe acid reflux, mouth ulcers, digestive track (sic) problems, osteogenesis imperfecta, allergies, high cholesterol, and hypertension).
Phillip Lafon (ID# 2216622) said: “I do not need to say any of that for people to order the product.â€
Well obviously you do or you wouldn’t be selling the juice using illegal advertising. I don’t think you’ve learned much from this lesson Phillip, other than that some people won’t sit idly by while you break the law. But ultimately, I believe that you’ll go back to making the exact same illegal claims in private. If you do, you better hope that we don’t hear about it. you’re doomed to fail anyway, so in the long run it won’t matter (aside from the harm you’ll cause to the victims of your fraud).
Phillip Lafon (ID# 2216622) said: “Trust this I will return each year to update you on the success of the company and in ten to twenty years after Monavie is the largest privately held company in the world.â€
Seriously man, you are sadly delusional. Monavie doesn’t have a large enough annual revenue to even crack the bottom of the Forbes list of private companies. Forbes is the only list that matters – your little rink-dink Inc. mag BS is meaningless.
http://www.forbes.com/lists/2009/21/private-companies-09_Americas-Largest-Private-Companies_Rank.html
A one-trick pony pyramid scheme like Monavie would never have a hope and hell of making Forbe’s list. In fact, Forbe’s already concluded that Monavie is a pyrmaid scheme.
http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2008/0811/050.html
I’m going to make a prediction about your claim that you’ll be coming back for 10-20 years to tell us about Monavie — I bet that within 2 years or less you (a) will no longer be selling Monavie, or (b) will be destitute, and/or (c) your wife will have left you. Just call it a hunch.
July 31st, 2010 at 9:15 am
Vogel,
You go beyond the point of this discussion which shows me that you are a disturbed person for one reason or another. I am sorry about the events in your life that led you to be such a hateful person. I have never called any of you any names.
You said : “It is NOT typical to have fruit juice or antioxidants cure or treat ANY of the diseases you claimed”
If i can say it does then you cannot say it doesn’t. Are you denying the fact that diseases are caused by inflammation? Are you denying that antioxidants do not fight inflammation? Are you denying the fact cells that are regenerated at all times in your body cannot produce healthier ones if you have the right nutrition? If so then you have no place speaking about fruit and its benefits or lack there of.
You said: “I’m going to make a prediction about your claim that you’ll be coming back for 10-20 years to tell us about Monavie — I bet that within 2 years or less you (a) will no longer be selling Monavie, or (b) will be destitute, and/or (c) your wife will have left you. Just call it a hunch.”
First of all I have been drinking for a year now and love it and have no intentons of stopping regardless so 2 years is not ver far off. It does not matter if I ever share it with anyone else again. Secondly my wife is more in love with it then I am so no fear of losing her over it. Thirdly the fact that you make statements like these further shows that you have a lot more going on with your inner happiness then any satisfaction you will ever get posting on this site.
The only reason I came back was because I knew that you probably had said stupid stuff and your right knowing that actually intrigues me. So you know what, I may never leave now its beginning to entertain me.
July 31st, 2010 at 9:20 am
Vogel,
This link does not represent Monavie this guy is only a distributor.
http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2008/0811/050.html
I dont even really like this guy..
July 31st, 2010 at 9:24 am
Oh and by the way if you work someone at any business ….. ok get ready for it i hope it dont hurt to ruin your world when i say this …. but you are part of a pyramid … its a scheme for you to do all there work and you will never make as much as they do.
Oh and if you own your business then shame on you for running a pyramid scheme and sucking people in to do all your work and never let them make as much as you do. Shame on all business owners.
Oh but wait in Monavie there are people who make more than someone above them … wait a sec how could this be. You mean Steve Merritt makes more then the person who got him to join Monavie … how could that be?
July 31st, 2010 at 9:50 am
Phillip Lafon (ID# 2216622) said: “Vogel, This link does not represent Monavie this guy is only a distributor. http://www.forbes.com/forbes/2008/0811/050.html. I dont even really like this guy.â€
First of all douche-nozzle, if you plan to keep participating in the discussion, then don’t keep saying that you’ll never be back again. It’s F-ing annoying and it makes you look like even more of a fool.
Secondly Orrin Woodward most certainly represents Monavie. How can you even begin to suggest that one of their highest-paid and most high-profile executives doesn’t represent the company? Is your assertion that no distributor, regardless of rank, represents the company? If so, then no one should ever listen to a single word that any distributor of Monavie has to say (which is actually good advice in general). You and the company are more than happy to embrace and leverage any immoral sack-of crap like Woodward or Lou Niles when you think they can help you sell juice, until its revealed that they are pyramid-scammers and child rapists, and then suddenly ‘they don’t represent the company’. Pathetic!
Miraculously, you said one thing that I can agree with – I dislike Orrin too.
Phillip Lafon (ID# 2216622) said: “Oh and by the way if you work someone at any business ….. ok get ready for it i hope it dont hurt to ruin your world when i say this …. but you are part of a pyramid … its a scheme for you to do all there work and you will never make as much as they do.â€
Ruin my world? What a flaming idiot. You don’t know a damn thing about what I do for a living. And your central premise is moronic – you’re saying that everything is pyramid scheme. That’s a simpleminded lie, and it’s been addressed too many times to count.
http://www.juicescam.com/monavie-distributor-your-job-is-a-pyramid-too
Business owners provide steady salaries (above minimum wage in marked contrast with Monavie) and lucrative benefits (healthcare, 401K, etc). They don’t charge their employees money for the privilege of employment, nor does an employee’s paycheck depend on how many new employees they recruit. You’re a lost cause Phillip — a sad desperate train-wreck of a human being. Like I predicted, within 2 years time, you won’t be selling Monavie or you’ll be destitute and divorced. Call it an educated guess.
July 31st, 2010 at 5:50 pm
Listen here Vogel … you twist everything everyone says your the lost cause.
I said the article does not represent Monavie because it is talking about his support system and all the motivational conferences. You cannot take an individual and what he/she chooses to do with something and project it on everything. Thats all I was saying. Monavie its self does not sale any motivational tools or cds of people speaking. When Monavie has a convention yes they have speakers about the product but not life coaches or inspirational speakers. Oh and yes vogel I know the speakers are idiots and not real scientist I understand how you feel I am just making the point that its not like Orrin’s support TEAM.
I did not say everything is a pyramid scheme. I said everything is a pyramid. You have someone at the top and everyone underneath them will never make more. That is not the case with Monavie and you so cleverly avoid the point i made and example of where you can make more then someone above you. You cannot deny the fact that most MLM companies this is not the case. Furthermore to say Monavie is a pyramid scheme is to say all MLM companies are pyramid schemes. So I guess now Donald Trump is involved in pyramid schemes huh, since he now owns a MLM company? I guess Avon and Mary Kay are horrible companies too right?
You are still saying I am going to be destitute and divorced and i clearly stated my wife loves this company as much if not more than I do so you are very stupidly wrong there. Oh and nothing about you is educated you may know how to look some things on the internet up and you are interestingly talented at twisting peoples words and reaching for insults out of no where, but I dont think anyone here even the ones that agree with you would call you educated.
Oh and about saying I would not be back. Yes I did say that before but clearly told you why I was and that now your absurdness has become entertaining because I have never encountered such a ignoramus person in my life. So really Vogel stop reaching so hard for insults it only makes you look like the fool. I guarantee the people that agree with you on here deep down think you are a fool as well.
July 31st, 2010 at 7:27 pm
The article most definitely is about MonaVie. For example, there’s the quote of “Team is one step ahead of all these juice selling schemes. It is a pyramid atop a pyramid.” That’s Forbes calling MonaVie a pyramid scheme.
Other jobs are not pyramids because they don’t rely on recruiting to make money. They make money by actually performing a service… which is something that is very rare from a MonaVie distributor. Ebay performs the service just as well as any distributor… probably better since you don’t usually get a lot of illegal marketing involved.
Plafon, please read http://www.juicescam.com/monavie-distributor-your-job-is-a-pyramid-too... especially the example about a restaurant that employs more high paid cooks than it does low-paid dishwashers. There’s not a pyramid there. And again, these people are performing work… producing a product, not recruiting people to recruit people.
We’ve seen videos from MonaVie conventions… Famously we’ve seen Dr. Clayton (one of those speakers speaking about the product) talk a lot of nonsense not really related to the product at all… see: http://www.juicescam.com/monavie-mmun-dr-paul-clayton-and-wellmune/.
If you want to talk about Donald Trump, Avon, and Mary Kay, see http://www.juicescam.com/warren-buffetts-pampered-chef-and-monavie/, where that discussion has been discussed for quite awhile now. Please use these archives: http://www.juicescam.com/archive/ and see if your questions have already been answered. Chances are they have been… we really don’t need to cover territory that has been covered already.
Before you claim that Vogel isn’t educated, you really do need to read around the site a lot more – maybe start with the one where Vogel completely destroyed Dr. Clayton in the previous link.
Vogel does a lot more than just pull up research, he analyzes it very thoroughly and shows he knows the science better than anyone in MonaVie. If you don’t believe it, then please send someone from MonaVie here to debate any of the topics. There’s a reason why MonaVie stays away from this site… they know it is scam.
July 31st, 2010 at 7:58 pm
If Vogel is so educated why the harshness and name calling. I have never come across a truly learned person who acts this way. Kind of bizarre.
July 31st, 2010 at 8:14 pm
I think you are getting off easy on the harshness and name calling…
We’ve all spent a lot of time here doing MonaVie’s job of trying to educate distributors and keeping them in compliance. Yet, distributors come here and fight with us. When they do something clearly illegal and we point it out, distributors don’t stop and say “Thank you for letting me know… You potentially saving my business. I owe you one.”
July 31st, 2010 at 9:02 pm
Phillip Lafon said: “If Vogel is so educated why the harshness and name calling. I have never come across a truly learned person who acts this way. Kind of bizarre.â€
I doubt you’d recognize a learned person if your life depended on it. Education and ‘harshness’ aren’t mutually exclusive.
I’ll put it to you this way.
1. You were illegally marketing Monavie using prohibited medical claims – that makes you a lawbreaker, unethical, and a disreputable business person.
2. The particular types of illegal claims that you are making are that kind that could cause serious injury and needless suffering to your customers. It’s bad enough that you recommend this crap fools-juice as a pain reliever, but when you start telling people that it can treat high cholesterol and hypertension (and who knows what else), you run a very real risk of causing harm. Now imagine that I caught you in person trying to con my grandmother into paying you $45 from her pension for your F-ing pathetic juice as a remedy for hypertesnion; and not only that, but also trying to your damndest to convince her that she should pay to become a distributor under you so that she too can sell the juice to her friends with hypertension and other diseases while you profit from it. Do you have any idea how lucky you are that I didn’t catch you in that scenario instead of just stumbling across your illegal claims on the internet? I would F-ing destroy you, and they would need NASA to find your body parts. Does that surprise you? It shouldn’t. Good people are incensed when they witness abominable behavior like yours, and they don’t sit idly by and let innocent people be victimized and lied to.
3. After we warned you about the illegality of your claims, you didn’t even apologize, let alone thank us.
4. You continue to post meaningless drivel. Despite the fact that this is a site dedicated to quite high level research and analysis, you insist on lowering the bar with every post. You are a waste of our resources.
Is it clear now you why you aren’t respected? Do you understand why I call you names? Why shouldn’t I. You deserve to be called names — actually you deserve to have your ass kicked, so be thankful that you’re just being called names.
August 1st, 2010 at 7:28 am
Phillip, you say “When Monavie has a convention yes they have speakers about the product but not life coaches or inspirational speakers.”
Maybe I am reading this incorrectly but have you seen the latest “line up” for your next convention (“Family Reunion” in Florida)? It is chock full of religious motivational speakers. I am fairly certain that they aren’t going to be talking about Monavie. Let me know if I am wrong.
August 1st, 2010 at 5:20 pm
Humiliated,
That is an R3global event not corporate.
August 1st, 2010 at 5:42 pm
Phillip Lafon (ID# 2216622) states “Secondly my wife is more in love with it then I am so no fear of losing her over it.â€
I believe I misread the above statement in my previous post (which I note is awaiting approval).
If Phillip’s wife is more in love with the crap juice, then suffice to say she’s as big an idiot as Phillip – if not bigger.
Vogel you’re correct in that these people aren’t deserving of respect – but rather contempt. Their behaviour, which is intended to trick consumers into investing in a product on the basis of their bogus health claims, is unconscionable and constitutes fraud.
August 1st, 2010 at 6:23 pm
Plafon,
The point that Humiliated made still stands. MonaVie Distributors, in huge amounts are being asked by their upline to go to an event that is chock full of religious motivational speakers.
The distinction between MonaVie and R3Global is just a minor correction, but it is inconsequential to the cult-like activity that is actually taking place. And that is really all that matters.
August 1st, 2010 at 7:20 pm
Ok so first Vogel ripped Clayton LOL……Pure opinion
[Editor's Response: I guess the term "ripped" is opinion, but it is a fact that he caught Clayton telling numerous exaggerations in an attempt to mislead people.]
2nd THe reason Monavie stays away because they know it’s a scam? LOL another terrible opinion
[Editor's Response: It is an opinion, but it's the only logical conclusion. MonaVie has no other reason not to address the topics here other than the fact that they can't. By addressing the topics here and on my other post (http://www.lazymanandmoney.com/monavie-scam-was-my-wife-recruited-sell-snake-oil/), they'd have thousands more customers. Don't say that is opinion either because MonaVie sent me a cease and desist because I was hurting their business (http://www.lazymanandmoney.com/monavie-sends-a-second-cease-desist/).]
Then Vogel says to Plafon “I would F-ing destroy you, and they would need NASA to find your body parts”
Wow…..Is Vogel serious? This guys is a little angry troll. My guess he’s about 5’4 bald and has 2 friends in the world.
Who wants to trust anything or respect anything from someone who would say something of that nature. Vogel hides behind his little cpu and spouts his nonsense over and over.
[Editor's Response: Ignore the person, look at the information. It checks out. Stop trying to deflect the topic away from MonaVie... the topic of this website.]
The problem with this site that you guys find things and then speculate and try to pass them off as facts.
[Editor's Response: There are a lot more facts than speculation. There is some speculation added to the facts, but, for example, no one has ever disputed the fact that MonaVie lies about the ORAC value of MonaVie: http://www.juicescam.com/monavie-lies-about-the-orac-score-of-monavie/. The facts are there, no speculation necessary.]
You guys really should go directly to Monavie with all your doubts and concerns.
Scam,
Do that ask them about the product concerns. Try to interview them instead of hiding on this site and speculating all the time. Do some real work instead of finding things on Google and then speculating.
[Editor's Response: We want MonaVie to address these doubts and concerns in the open, not on some private phone call or off-the-record email. I have had conversations with MonaVie's Shante Schroeder - this is well-covered territory. I have had offers from distributors to get a Black Diamond to address doubts and concerns. I have gone through the work to create a list. I submit the list and the distributors comes back and says (paraphrased), "My Black Diamond friend said that these people are full of negative energy and that I should spend my time building the business." This was a typical blow off. In my dealings with MonaVie they have brought only half-baked legal threats (see above link) and no attempt to address any concern about the juice.
In the end, I don't see how we can come to an understanding, when I can report to MonaVie a distributor caught red-handed with a multitude of illegal activity and they allow the person to still be a distributor: see Mitch Biggs Scams People and MonaVie Condones It. Any reputable company would have said, "Wow, what this guy was doing was egregious and he certainly knew better since he was one of our top people (Emerald level). There's no excuse for this and we have no choice other than to terminate his distributorship." Nope, they just cleaned up his mistakes like Enron with a paper shredder...]
Scam calling the meeting in Orlando a cult meeting. I guess Myles Monroe is a big cult motivator? LOL he is one of the more respected Motivational and Inspirational figures in America. He has wrote many successful Books. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myles_Munroe
[Editor's Response: After reading that Wikipedia article, I stand corrected. Wait, no I don't. This is just a further attempt by R3Global to pair religion and MonaVie together. This is just another brainwashing trick to keep distributors in the business longer, so R3Global, BrigHart, and MonaVie can make more money. When was the last time Ocean Spray or Welch's had a big convention with such focus on religion? What about Subway for their franchise owners?]
September 8th, 2010 at 7:40 am
If it is a placebo, how did my bloodpressure regulate, how did my cholesterol drop 40 points, triglycerides 260 (yes thats how high they were, my arthritis evaporated..I don’t make money with this produce I just love and thank god it came into my life
September 8th, 2010 at 10:12 am
Steve,
It sounds like I answered those questions previously in other posts.
Please see MonaVie Medical Testimonies are Pointless and “I am not a MonaVie distributor, but…”
September 8th, 2010 at 11:19 am
[Editor's Note: The following comment shows that Steve isn't smart enough to read Dallin Larsen, Ernst and Young, and Entrepreneur Of The Year, even though I suggested him to read it previously... All his answers are there and he is actually the liar. I back up my information with facts and direct links to Ernst and Young and he just gives lies. You be the judge.]
Hey Monavie Scam, you are so full of facts..can you direct us to the site that says Ernst and Young admitted doing zero research to elect their CEO Entrepreneur of the year…Then put a blow up MONAVIE bottle in their international headquarters congratulating Monavie’s CEO…You do realize that when you lied about Ernst and Young admitting they did no research to elect their companies CEO of the year award…you basically confirmed you are scammer, liar and a fruad. Up until that point you actually almost held your own…but you blew it…time to leave the public library, hop on your moped and buzz back to the trailer park…probably need to pump up the tires on your house anyways….
September 8th, 2010 at 12:10 pm
Stevie, you are a truly disgusting individual. You lie (and break the law) by allegeing that Monavie can treat dieases, you bring not a single fact to the table, and you fall back on really lame personal attacks on the blog host. WTF dude??? Mopeds? Trailer park? Are you serious?
E&Y’s research obviously sucked since they failed to acknowledge Larsen’s epic failure during his stint as chief swindler for Royal Tongan Limu.
Once again we witness a distributor who is too obtuse to post their comment on the relevant thread. There is already a thread on E&Y, so post your E&Y comments there fool. JS already addressed the issues quite well.
November 9th, 2010 at 10:02 pm
Hey all,
I just stumbled upon this article and I thought you guys would find it interesting.
http://youarenotsosmart.com/2010/02/10/placebo-buttons/
The placebo effect is real.
February 17th, 2011 at 6:13 am
http://www.cnn.com/2011/HEALTH/02/16/pessimistic.pain.meds/index.html?hpt=C2
Article on the placebo effect. Just replace “pain medicine” with MonaVie and Voila!
February 17th, 2011 at 7:17 am
This is my favorite quote from that:
There’s no question that MonaVie fosters a feeling of “positiveness” during their conventions and such. So many distributors have commented about being open-minded that I had to post a counter article about it: http://www.juicescam.com/being-open-minded-about-monavie/. They also mention the Price-Placebo Effect with MonaVie.
May 11th, 2011 at 3:15 pm
Here’s a good link about price-placebo.
http://www.scienceagogo.com/news/20080204181613data_trunc_sys.shtml
This is why MonaVie comes in slick looking wine bottles. It’s also over-priced, adding to the effect. There’s actually a few things going on to make a good placebo effect:
1. Price
2. Packaging
3. “Belief” through the constant pep talks
4. Misinformation with speakers implying MonaVie is superior to prescription meds.
5. Group think (“stand up if the juice has given you health benefits”, and everyone stands up with zeal)
6. Getting the person “hooked” through promises of great health and wealth (and more disgustingly, getting kids to drink it, so they can say “if you care about your kids you will give them this”)
The placebo effect is quite something. In one study, people were injected with a medicine that induces vomiting and were told that the medicine prevents vomiting, and some participants actually felt like they didn’t have to vomit.
May 11th, 2011 at 7:22 pm
Yep, all this information is true. They’ve stacked on multiple layers of placebo effect together. This is why I any testimonial can be easily explained. Then you add in the people who just outright scammers and it becomes really significant.