MonaVie and the Placebo Effect |
38 Comments |
There are times where people will give a testimony that MonaVie helped them with [medical condition X]. I assert that it is really impossible to tell if MonaVie did that for the individual. If you are being open-minded about MonaVie, you know that other explanations are possible. Perhaps a change in weather made a difference. Perhaps a less stressful life helped. It’s really hard to say, but I’d say that the best explanation is the placebo effect. Here’s what Wikipedia has to say on the Placebo Effect:
“A placebo is a sham medical intervention. In one common placebo procedure, a patient is given an inert sugar pill, told that it may improve his/her condition, but not told that it is in fact inert. Such an intervention may cause the patient to believe the treatment will change his/her condition; and this belief does indeed sometimes have a therapeutic effect, causing the patient’s condition to improve. This phenomenon is known as the placebo effect.”
I added the bolding myself for emphasis. If the power of positive thinking can have a proven therapeutic effect, it is reasonable to assert that drinkers of MonaVie may be experiencing this. Why might people think MonaVie would improve his/her condition? I can think of three reasons (there may be more):
- Distributors or the Internet say is does – You can search Google and find tons of references of MonaVie being linked to supposedly helping people with autism. These are unverifiable claims that may be added by distributors to help sell their product.
- MonaVie’s serving size is medicine-sized – People are used to taking medicine in doses of 1 ounce or less. People drink juices in serving sizes of 8 ounces or more. MonaVie’s juice is in a 1 ounce serving size increasing it’s similarity to juice. You’ll never hear anyone talk about drinking MonaVie as a thirst-quenching beverage like any other juice.
- Distirbutors use language like “taking” MonaVie – You’ll hear people say all the time that they “take” MonaVie in the morning and night. You “take” pills and medicine – not juice. No one says that they “take” a glass of orange juice at night time. You drink juice. Listen for when people say that they are taking MonaVie and you can spot that they may be subtly trying to trick you (or they are unaware that they’ve been tricked themselves) that it’s medicine.
It’s also worth noting that’s an additional placebo effect here… the Price-Placebo Effect. Scientists have shown that people perceive a product to have more value when they pay more for it. They not only think that, but the product seems to “work” more because of it. In fact, people told they were spending more money for a energy drink actually performed better on mental tasks.
So we see here that there are two reasons why MonaVie may appear to provide some kind of benefit to a person – without physically providing it. Some may say that it’s irrelevant, they just want the benefit. I understand that line of thinking, but realize that placebos can be had cheaply. If you really want the Price-Placebo effect, you should buy your placebos from a friend at a high price and sell him yours at the same high price.
It is well-worth noting that one can’t argue it’s not the placebo effect as it works subconsciously. They simply can’t know what’s in their subconscious as that is the very definition of subconscious. So if someone says that they know their body and MonaVie helped it and it wasn’t the placebo effect (as I’ve seen numerous times), you know that they really don’t understand the placebo effect and how it works.
Originally posted 2009-11-24 10:00:10.
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PropellerNext: Dr. Alex Schauss and MonaVie
November 29th, 2009 at 10:15 am
Perception is reality even if it is not reality in actuality.
March 24th, 2010 at 12:34 am
Try arguing against double-blind placebo tests.
March 24th, 2010 at 6:11 am
Show me a double-blind placebo test where MonaVie was shown to have medicinal benefits.
April 7th, 2010 at 6:45 am
its been 2 weeks anon, where are the double blind tests you speak of??? hmmmmmmmmmmm. do you also sleep under a magnet blanket?
April 14th, 2010 at 11:52 am
MonaVie Active Clinical Study
1. In a double-blind, placebo controlled, crossover clinical study, subjects taking MonaVie Active—which contains a blend of 19 fruits, including açai—had a significant increase in their antioxidant capacity and inhibition of lipid peroxidation.
2. Fats like cholesterol circulating in the blood stream are easily oxidized by free radicals. This is called lipid peroxidation. Lipid peroxidation has been shown to be damaging to the circulatory system. Studies have shown that reduction of lipid peroxidation has been associated with improved cardiovascular well-being.
3. 83.3% of study participants had a statistically significant increase (relative to placebo) in antioxidant activity within their cells.
4. This study also supports that drinking 4 ounces of MonaVie Active daily helps increase the antioxidant capacity in the body.
Note: This study was conducted in a relatively small number of healthy adults. Further studies with larger sample sizes are needed before these results can be generalized to the population-at-large.
April 14th, 2010 at 11:56 am
MonaVie Active Structure/Function Claims (Glucosamine)
1. MonaVie Active contains the additional benefits of glucosamine, a natural substance found in healthy joint cartilage.
2. Glucosamine helps build glycoproteins, glycosaminoglycans and proteoglycans, which are essential to making and maintaining healthy connective tissue and joint cartilage.
3. Glucosamine, when taken regularly at 1500mg per day, may help maintain healthy joint function and improve joint comfort.
4. Glucosamine, when taken regularly at 1500 mg per day may help with minor aches and pains associated with post exercise recovery.
April 14th, 2010 at 1:42 pm
How much glucosamine is in MonaVie Active? I only see claims of what glucosamine “may” do at 1500 mg per day, but no information as to if MonaVie has that.
However, I can be assured of getting 95 days of 1500mg of glucosamine for $28 here on Amazon. That makes glucosamine retail for about $0.30 per 1500mg. If we make the assumption that MonaVie’s recommended amount of 4 ounces a day has 1500mg (huge assumption, but I don’t know what else to go on) at the retail price for Active it is $7.20 per 1500mg of glucosamine.
This shouldn’t be surprising because I found all the MonaVie Pulse Structure/Functio Claims (Plant Sterols) can be made by a pill that costs 7 cents. It’s clear that MonaVie is just taking these very cheap additives and using them so that distributors and marketing can make seemingly convincing claims like Pearman 7 listed above. Sadly they fall apart when you just scratch the surface.
I won’t even bring up that there are conflicting studies on the efficacy of glucosamine and studies mentioned here. Oh wait I just did.
April 14th, 2010 at 1:50 pm
The MonaVie Active Clinical Study, it didn’t show any medicinal benefit can be had by MonaVie. I thoroughly debunk this study on 9/28/2008 in comment 974 here: http://www.lazymanandmoney.com/monaVieArchive.php. At some point I will do so more formally here, but I have been busy.
For those too lazy to click the summary of it was that the juice didn’t have a base that included eating a normal amount of recommended fruit. Thus they were comparing people who eat no fruit and had no sources of antioxidants to people who have drank some (MonaVie). The same or even better results could have been had by a small amount of vitamin C. MonaVie has to prove more than “it’s better than nothing” to justify being priced 10 to 20 times as much as other juices. It needs to prove that it is 10 to 20 times more effective than other juices. Men’s Journal has commissioned an independent lab and MonaVie came back worse than the cheaper juices in just about every way: http://www.juicescam.com/mens-journal-proves-monavie-lacks-nutrition/
April 14th, 2010 at 2:56 pm
Look Pearman, you dipshit, since you can’t make an argument for yourself and you have to rely on Monavie brochures, which we’ve all seen and discounted already, at least have the sense to just post the link instead of cutting and pasting reams of crap.
July 24th, 2010 at 10:03 am
You guys are arguing for no good reason. The fact is the product is amazing I know over 50 people personally that drink it and our lives have changed. The integrity of the company is amazing and they have put in the scientific work. If you cant find these results its your own fault. Why beat up a product that works if you choose not to drink it and you can get something cheaper then by all means get whatever you want but why such a desire to try to make Monavie look like something fake. If it helps people that have not had relief anywhere else then so be it leave them alone.
July 24th, 2010 at 4:24 pm
I know over 100 people who have had their lives ruined by MonaVie. See what I did there, plafon?
The integrity of the company is obviously not amazing as this site shows. The scientific work is full of holes.
I beat up the product because it doesn’t work. It doesn’t even quench thirst. As you can see in the article above it is an expensive placebo.
July 25th, 2010 at 5:46 pm
Your obviously delusional. Monavie cannot ruin someones life regardless whether they felt or saw results its only whole food and cannot hurt or ruin anyones life. I will not waste time and energy here. I personally know several black diamonds in Monavie and have seen and heard about every positive and negative there is about the company. You can say whatever you want to … but it changes nothing. The company and product is amazing and it will continue to grow whether your hilarious and delusional comments continue on here and regardless of who agrees with you. The science is there whether you know it or not really does not matter. Go to http://www.monavietv.com and look for the Vison 2010 convention clips and watch the scientist speak about it. I am sure you will still be negative because people like you are malicious and really just ignorant but maybe someone else who reads this will be enlightened.
July 25th, 2010 at 7:43 pm
plafon states ” Your obviously delusional. Monavie cannot ruin someones life regardless whether they felt or saw results its only whole food and cannot hurt or ruin anyones life. I will not waste time and energy here. I personally know several black diamonds in Monavie and have seen and heard about every positive and negative there is about the company. You can say whatever you want to … but it changes nothing. The company and product is amazing and it will continue to grow whether your hilarious and delusional comments continue on here and regardless of who agrees with you. The science is there whether you know it or not really does not matter.”
The science is there for sure – Dr Schauss’ own research confirms Monavie has an ORAC of 22.81 and phenolics totalling 175mg. That is, a days serving of Monavie has the nutritional content of less than half an apple.
Perhaps you’re privy to scietific studies that we’re not so please feel free to share these if that’s the case.
How is a company not doing harm to individuals (and their communities) who invest to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars each year on the basis of the blatant misrepresentations concerning the product and after having had vital pieces of information concerning the opportunity withheld from them as at the time of signing up – such as the 99.64% loss rate which is evidenced on the IDS.
Whilst your own distorted views are a product of being enlightened by Monavie propaganda, former Monavie Royal Black Diamond, Kelly Bangert provides a more realistic picture concerning the impact this company has had on his life through his description of his business plummeting throughout 2009 and that of his Blue Diamond’s life who had his house foreclosed on, another Blue Diamond who lost his car and his top leaders who couldn’t even pay their bills.
http://www.mlmwatchdog.com/files/DOCUMENTS/Xowii_v._Monavie.pdf
What’s amazing is there are distributors such as yourself who have the facts available to you but still insist on defending the inconsistencies and misrepresenting the facts yourself – all because you’re DELUDED enough to believe you’re climbing to the top of the pyramid.
July 25th, 2010 at 7:52 pm
Plafon: “The fact is the product is amazing I know over 50 people personally that drink it and our lives have changed.”
Apparently you don’t know the difference between a FACT and an opinion; your statement was the latter. Is the product so amazing and life changing that you can’t even begin to articulate the reasons why? Did Monavie erase your memory?
Plafon said: “The integrity of the company is amazing and they have put in the scientific work. If you cant find these results its your own fault.”
Integrity??? ROFL!!! We found dozens of FACTS that show that the integrity of the company couldn’t be much worse. I could run through the list of names and notorious accomplishments of those in the Monavie Hall of Shame, but what would be the point? It won’t stop you from BSing nor cure you of delusional thinking. You would just bury your head in the sand and continue to deny what’s painfully obvious to any rational person.
Plafon said: “If it helps people that have not had relief anywhere else then so be it leave them alone.”
Relief from what??? Monavie doesn’t even relieve thirst. Helped who??? How??? When you say ‘leave them alone,’ what you really mean is ‘don’t tell the truth’.
Plafon said: “Your obviously delusional. Monavie cannot ruin someones life regardless whether they felt or saw results its only whole food and cannot hurt or ruin anyones life.”
You failed to grasp the point that ‘Monavie Scam’ was making. It’s no more delusional to say that Monavie has hurt 100 people than it is to blindly assert that it helped 50. And you aren’t thinking clearly; on the one hand you say we’re delusional because we don’t believe your fantasies about Monavie treating diseases, and then on the other, you say that Monavie is just food. You only get to pick one side of an argument. BTW, fruit juice doesn’t change lives — except in Monavie’s case…by ruining them.
Plafon said: “I will not waste time and energy here.
Oh I how I wish that were true, but we’ve heard that line before. Sadly, you’ll probably be back — but it won’t be your time that will be wasted. If you do come back, you should post your name and distributor ID# as required. My guess is you’re far too ashamed to do so.
July 25th, 2010 at 8:01 pm
You are the delusional ones. We’ve seen first-hand people tell their story here. They ended up trying to sell the worthless expensive juice to all their friends and family and ruined their relationships and lead them to financial ruin. Anonymous Aussie, who comments here often, told me one story. Another person emailed me the story you can read here: http://www.lazymanandmoney.com/my-friend-is-brainwashed-by-get-rich-quick-schemes-help/.
You obviously haven’t talked to Black Diamond Kelly Bangert: See exhibit B here: http://www.mlmwatchdog.com/files/DOCUMENTS/Xowii_v._Monavie.pdf.
You can see the proof on this website… there are more than 75 articles that prove that the company and product is not amazing. In fact, not one positive fact has come from MonaVie. Even the charity associated with them, the MORE project misuses donations and doesn’t file required paperwork.
The science is clearly not there… if you read any of the articles on this website, you’d know that it’s not open to interpretation. It’s not opinion… it is logically very shoddy science. If you don’t believe me, believe the reputable doctors: Dr. Andrew Weil (formally in Time Magazine’s top 25 Americans and top 100 people in the world), Dr. Dean Edell, and Dr. Jonny Bowden have spoken out against MonaVie. These are independent doctors who are nationally recognized.
MonaVie’s “science” is contributed by exclusively by people paid by MonaVie. That’s especially true of the scientists on monavietv.com. That should tell you all you really need to know.
Plafon, you are clearly brainwashed like the person I mentioned above. You are quick to use the MonaVie brainwash lingo like calling people negative when they just trying to help not spend $45 for 25 ounces of juice. If you were selling Honda Accords for $200,000 would you be calling me negative for trying to warn people? I’m sure you would. You are quick to call someone ignorant, when you haven’t done the research.
July 26th, 2010 at 7:54 am
Thanks for your comments but I know what it has done for my wife who is a super healthy eater already and it help her pack pain of 5 years and my sister who had back pain hip pain and leg pain who stayed on the couch most of the time is now living actively. My freind with fibromyalgia that was stuck in her house most of the time because of pain now lives an active life at 75 years of age. I could contimue but no point.
Kelly Bangert is still a black diamond and at the convention in June. His story was a bummer but he has rebuilt. Calvin Becerra that was apart of his team was effecting by it as well and has also rebuilt his business.
Dr. Shcauss was around 30 years in scince before MOnavie and would not risk his career on something that was not really what he says it is.
I will use this experience with you to do my homework little more in detail.
We have been blessed by this product and the balck diamonds that have welcomed us intheir homes in NC have been like a second family and they have no reason to welcome us because we are not even a part of their downline. I spent the 4th of July with Brig Hart, Steve Merritt, Charlie Kalb, Bob Robinson, Matt Curtis, Grayson Maule, Brian Thayer, and several blue diamonds. I know these people personally and they hearts for God. I am a christian as well and I have been around the block and I am very analytical. I have seen nothing but pure hearted people since day one.
I do apologize for calling you delusional I was a little upset, I hope you accept my apology.
God bless you in your future endeavors.
July 26th, 2010 at 9:17 am
Plafon,
I see that you are MonaVie distributor… it’s not like you hid that fact with your email address. Please stop spreading illegal medical claims and testimonies.
Kelly Bangert came crawling back after being threatened by MonaVie’s anti-competitive behavior. If he wants to sell both juices, there should be no problem with that. My HomeDepot sells light bulbs from multiple manufacturers.
Dr. Schauss got his degree via mail order from a university that doesn’t require lab work (from what I recall…. there’s more information about that on this site).
It’s interesting that you end with the religious aspect. On my other site, there is significant recent discussion on how they are using religion to make people believe that selling overpriced, nutrition-deficient juice is God’s work. See the recent comments at the bottom of: http://www.lazymanandmoney.com/monavie-scam-was-my-wife-recruited-sell-snake-oil/.
July 26th, 2010 at 9:18 am
Oh and Plafon… please leave your name and distributor ID number as required by: http://monaviemediacenter.com/policies-and-procedures-update—social-media
July 26th, 2010 at 10:04 am
You are the one that asked what it relived and how did it help so i just answered your questions. By the way Kelly Bangert did not crawl back he realized that spliting his team between 2 companies was stupid. He made an honest mistake.
I am so glad you responded in that manner, I feel much better now to what type of person i was dealing with.
Have a great life.
July 26th, 2010 at 10:36 am
hey plafoon
you say and i quote.
“We have been blessed by this product and the balck diamonds that have welcomed us intheir homes in NC have been like a second family and they have no reason to welcome us because we are not even a part of their downline. I spent the 4th of July with Brig Hart, Steve Merritt, Charlie Kalb, Bob Robinson, Matt Curtis, Grayson Maule, Brian Thayer, and several blue diamonds. I know these people personally and they hearts for God. I am a christian as well and I have been around the block and I am very analytical. I have seen nothing but pure hearted people since day one. ”
plafoon,
i was part of monavie for a short while and decided to no longer be part of monavie because i did not like being a monabot. and wasting my money, anyways away from that i just wanted to bring up my expirence in as short of words as possible. my expirence with the whole home welcomming and friends like a second family and such.
before i started my future uplines were super friendly, gave me there numbers to text or call, 2 people in particular( sorry for my poor spelling) was never good at it. anyways when when i joined they were all over me like a fly on shit. and they were nice but they only wanted to talk business with me, and when it came to the business they were willing to go all the way with helping me, but i just couldnt afford to do what was required, and i wasnt willing to do what was asked by what i listened on the cds, like selling my stuff, like tv and such.
when i went to a bonfire promo, i had to be on system and on sot as a requirement to attend, which i was already on system because i was told to in order to get ahead , or else i wont make it in the business. anyways i had to be on standing order ticket,(SOT) and i did and went, was a nice fire, but no one just sat there shooting the shit, and talked normal, everyone talked about business stuff, and then when we all sat down for the fire, they just wanted to hear who we were and and what our goals are, and why we joined. and by the time everyone spoke, the fire was done and time for a 6 hour drive home. anyways at the time i thought it was fun because i was really trying to make it in the business but when i think back it was a wast of time and money.
when i talked to my uplines on the hone or texting, they would avoid any normal talk, just wanted business talk or questions, and so i decided to try in person talk, and none of them wanted to be my real friend, just a business friend if i was going to make them money by buying the over priced juice. and when i couldnt afford to buy the juice anymore, and go to meetings, they noticed and after i stopped recieving text messages and calls from my upline about house meetings and business launch meeting, and quotes from high uplines orrin woodward cds. anyways i realized they wernt my second family they were just opeople wanting to get rich off me, so i put a stop to that after i got more research from this site and others.
when you decide you are ready to retire, if you do, good luck if you make it that high, they wont allow it, look at kelly bangart, stuck there for life.even when his money dropped to almost nothing. you gatta read the site scam put up for you and you will see how he was threatened, once i mentioned i know the truth he stopped talking to me on facebook. i guess he is not allowed to speak the truth hence all th lies.
July 26th, 2010 at 1:17 pm
I see where you are coming from. Thats jsut the thing with me thats different though I have been to black diamonds houses just to chill out .. and they were not even my upline at all so no reason for them to talk business with me anyways. On July 4th we had a blast riding boats and catered food all paid for … We did not talk business not once. I never heard anyone talk business really .. occasional chit chat maybe .. but nothing major. Maybe you were involved with the wrong people. R3Global is amazing and the poeple are top notch.
Have a good day.
July 26th, 2010 at 2:58 pm
down hear it aint that nice, and for me to join a team way out there wouldnt help, cant afford to go out there to see them, and i wouldnt rejoin, not worth my time. or wasting my money, just my opinion
July 26th, 2010 at 4:22 pm
Plafon,
Even if someone asks you what MonaVie relieves or how it helps, you can legally say the things that you said. It is entirely possible that it could be coincidence or placebo effect as mentioned in this article. There’s nothing in MonaVie that has ever been clinically shown to have any medicinal effects as you say. It makes no more sense than me claiming my faucet has magic water that heals people.
Kelly Bangert wouldn’t have to split his team between two juices… he would allow his team more options to sell. They are completely different juices. Someone might like one more than the other, so this would be Kelly being a smarting salesman to have a back-up in case people didn’t like the first option. In the document that I cited earlier you can see that Kelly was clearly penalized by MonaVie, so it’s not an honest mistake. If it was an honest mistake and MonaVie was a reputable company there would not have been penalties.
Plafon, I noticed you responded a few times, but haven’t listed your distributor ID number and name as required by: http://monaviemediacenter.com/policies-and-procedures-update—social-media. I kind request you stay in compliance with your own company when commenting on this site.
However, you spent July 4th is not of consequence here. A drug dealer could have an awesome home too. Michael Vick’s home was awesome, but he was found guilty of illegal dog fighting. Kenneth Lay of Enron had all kinds of money and parties… it doesn’t mean he wasn’t scamming people. It doesn’t make him a good person.
July 27th, 2010 at 7:37 am
Your responses never deal with the point of what is being discussed you comment on small aspects of what is said that has nothing to do with the point of what is being said.
I can and will tell my family and friends experiences and there is nothing illegal about it I have not stated it would do the same for anyone else. And a PLACEBO effect does not last 4 years my friend. So give the placebo crap a rest. Also if you do not understand why it could effect people than you have absolutely no reason to even host this site. YOu use the term medicinal effect all the time… do you realize that every medicine comes from natural resouces and nutritional benefits.
Of course water out of your facucet cannot heal anything … but the proper nutrition absolutely can and thats fact. Ask any one that knows nutrition if you find and eat the right nutrition you can change several problems with your body. Take Monavie out of the picture completely and just research nutrition in general. So for you to make the statement that something nutritional cannot help anyone proves how bias and completely empty your mission on this site is.
What the heck are talking about with Michael Vick … I never said anything about big nice houses and has nothing to do with the point of what i said.
July 27th, 2010 at 7:41 am
Oh and the policy about distributor ID has nothing to do with me commenting on your Blog. This is not a blog I have created and I have never stated on here that I am a distributor and I am not giving anyone contact information or information on how to aquire the product.
July 27th, 2010 at 8:10 am
Plafon,
As far as I can tell three things are being discussed.
1) You wonder July 4th holiday with Black Diamonds enjoying all the pleasantries that were purchased by bilking people out of their hard-earned cash. You heavily implied that MonaVie and it’s Black Diamonds are great people because of this time you spent with them. I was simply saying that you could be treated the same by drug dealers or people who fight dogs. This means that the whole July 4th holiday experience you had is really not relevant to this website… other than to show the extreme amount of money they are bilking out of people.
2) The illegal medical claims you made about your friends and family experiences. (And no you can not tell them… see MonaVie’s only #1 rule of distributor guidelines here: http://monaviemediacenter.com/blogs/5-tips-every-monavie-distributor-needs-to-know-about-the-new-ftc-guidelines/. You can only tell what is “a typical result.” So if you don’t have clinical results that it would do the same for anyone else, you can’t say it. If MonaVie wants to go out and get clinical trials done on fibromyalgia, then you’ll be able to say it. In the meantime, please make yourself aware of the law and abide by it. Don’t hold your breath waiting for MonaVie to do such trials… they’ve had five years and haven’t started.
You completely misunderstand my point about nutrition. Proper nutrition is good for you. However, no juice is approved to prevent, treat, or cure any problem in the body… and no juice can improve on simply eating the fruit itself. MonaVie has to fortify it’s product with vitamins and fiber that are typically in fruit because their juice is naturally-deficient in these. Men’s Journal in an independent study proved this: http://www.juicescam.com/mens-journal-proves-monavie-lacks-nutrition/.
So please don’t play that game of nutrition. It’s been played here dozens, if not hundreds of times, and no one can make a claim that MonaVie almost completely void of vitamins, minerals, and fiber is more nutritious than fruit. It’s just modern day Snake oil (see the definition in that link.)
3) Your lack of posting your distributor ID.
The policy strictly states that commenting on any blog about MonaVie (whether selling the product or having created it or otherwise) requires the posting of distributor ID and name. This is specifically so that distributors can’t comment on blogs with illegal health claims as you have done.
Yes, you have not stated you are a distributor, we both know you are. If the FDA or FTC were to come to me about your illegal health claims or your testimonies, I could very easily give them my server logs and show without a doubt that you are breaking the law.
That’s really the point here. You are breaking the law, and claiming that you aren’t because you withheld information that you are a distributor.
And this is the case you make for MonaVie being a reputable business?
July 27th, 2010 at 8:26 am
LOL … you are so full of it. You are hilarious. I never tried to deny I was a ditributor I was simply stating that was not my intent here. MonaVie is very reputable despite what you think. You dont do a billion dollars in 36 months and not be. Find me a MLM company that was not reputable that did that volume.
Good bye I will not return I guarantee you that.
You are as bad as my ex-wife with twisting words and truths.
I find it so hilarious and I am so glad their are people like you because to face persecution means your doing something right. So your persecution of MonaVie only strengthens my faith in it. If they were doing nothing and accomplishing nothing no one would care and there would not be haters.
Bye Bye now.
July 27th, 2010 at 8:26 am
LOL ….. 2216622
July 27th, 2010 at 10:31 am
Glad you finally realized that one of two things had to be true.
1) You are a distributor and not complying with MonaVie’s rules on social media and violating the FTC’s guidelines that MonaVie has specifically asked that you adhere to.
2) You are not a distributor and lying.
It’s too bad it only took you about 8 posts to pick one.
Monavie is a private company. As such there is no reliable information about how much business the company is doing. Plus all business to distributors and not to end-users doesn’t count as retail sales which is the important number. If MonaVie has done a large business, it only reflects poorly on the distributors like yourself who continue to back it. Bernie Madoff’s pyramid scheme also did billions of dollars, so surely we must consider that reputable, right? Enron had more than a billion dollars in business too, so there you go. I’m not going to comment on the failures of other MLM companies. It just shows that MonaVie may be the most successful of a bad model. That’s like putting the best little league baseball player on an all-state high school team… the little league player isn’t really going to be any good.
July 27th, 2010 at 6:24 pm
plafon (ID# 2216622) said: “I can and will tell my family and friends experiences and there is nothing illegal about it I have not stated it would do the same for anyone else. And a PLACEBO effect does not last 4 years my friend. So give the placebo crap a rest.”
Hey Phillip, I’m going to cut you a break since you at least had enough gumption to post your ID# (albeit after being prodded). Unfortunately, the bad news for you is that I had a look at your Monavie website and found that you are illegally advertising the product using numerous testimonials (including your own and your wife Christine’s) implying that Monavie can treat, prevent, cure and/or mitigate the symptoms of diseases including: sciatica, knee pain, carpal tunnel syndrome, back pain, severe acid reflux, mouth ulcers, digestive track (sic) problems, osteogenesis imperfecta , allergies, high cholesterol, and hypertension.
http://phillipandchristinasstories.blogspot.com
I won’t engage in any argument with you about whether your advertising is illegal — it clearly is. It clearly violates the regulations set forth in the U.S. Code of Federal Regulations (Food & Drug Act) and the terms of your agreement with Monavie, which explicitly forbids you from (a) using testimonials, and (b) using implied medical claims to market the product. Monavie’s distributor training materials make these regulations and policies clear. I can’t imagine that you could be unaware of these regulations and policies, so I have to assume that you willfully chose to ignore them. That doesn’t speak well of your business ethics.
Just to recap, this is what the company says about the use of such testimonials:
“You may not make any claims or personal testimonials that state that MonaVie cures diseases, is therapeutic, is a treatment, mitigates, or is used to diagnose or prevent any disease, illness, or condition. If you say anything like that, not only are you violating MonaVie’s rules, you are also violating laws and regulations in your country.”
But since you were forthcoming with your ID#, I didn’t file a report with the FDA or notify the company regarding your violations yet. Instead, for now, I’ll give you the opportunity to remove the claims of your own accord, and I certainly hope that after you do remove them, you won’t continue to use such claims covertly offline. Should you choose not to comply, the complaints will be filed. You might also want to make amends with the people you swindled; I’ll leave that up to you.
Fair enough? I’m giving you this opportunity to redeem yourself because maybe, just maybe, you’re a decent enough person to do the right thing. Don’t disappoint me.
July 27th, 2010 at 8:02 pm
Great observations, Vogel!
I can’t help but continue to be disappointed that despite being spoon fed the details concerning the law and company policy which prohibits the use of testimonials such as those posted on Phillip’s site, distributors STILL continue to use these and even defend the use of same!
Phillip – if Monavie was so great, you wouldn’t need to break the law and breach company policy to sell the product. IF anyone you know has thought to have experienced benefits from what is proven to be a nutritionally void fruit juice, it’s in all likelihood because YOU (who is has a vested financial interest in the venture) planted the seed suggestive of it – you know, a placebo effect. Disgraceful.
July 28th, 2010 at 2:17 pm
Hey Phillip, I hope you don’t think I was kidding about reporting you. You have 24 more hours before the axe drops.
July 28th, 2010 at 4:05 pm
I note Phillip’s own testimonial in which he states “Phillip was having trouble sleeping, had lower back pain. knee pain from past basketball injuries, severe acid reflux, mouth ulcers and digestive track problems and after 2 days he was sleeping through the night and his lower back was not hurting as bad. After a week and a half his lower back rarely bothers him. After 4 weeks his digestive track was regulated and after 6 weeks his knee pain went away. Acid reflux rarely arises and all mouth ulcers have disappeared completely.”
There’s nothing contained within Monavie (which is NOTHING more than fruit juice) that would account for the improved of symptoms any of the above conditions and definitely not acid reflux – in fact, it is common knowledge that many fruits and fruit juices aggravate the symptoms of same so it’s more than safe to conclude Phillip’s testimony is absolute bull$hit.
I’d personally like to see not only the axe dropped but a bottle of that Monavie crap dropped on this fraudster’s head – the level of deceit is unbelievable.
July 28th, 2010 at 4:18 pm
i think phillip dug his own grave in the business which may cause his down hill and eventually losing his business.
July 29th, 2010 at 4:48 pm
Yup, bet the bitch thought I was bluffing. Guess what Phil — I just made good on my promise and filed a complaint with the FDA at http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/email/oc/buyonline/buyonlineform.cfm
Here’s a copy just in case you’re curious to know what you’ll be defending yourself against.
—————
Re: Phillip and Christine Lafon
http://phillipandchristinasstories.blogspot.com
Mr. and Mrs. Lafon are distributors of Monavie brand juice who are advertising the product using testimonials that state or imply that it can treat, prevent, cure and/or mitigate the symptoms of diseases including sciatica, knee pain, carpal tunnel syndrome, back pain, severe acid reflux, mouth ulcers, digestive track (sic) problems, osteogenesis imperfecta, allergies, high cholesterol, and hypertension.
These claims clearly promote Monavie (‘Original’, ‘Active’, and ‘Pulse’) for conditions that cause the products to be drugs under section 201(g)(1) of the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act (the Act) [21 U.S.C. § 321(g)(1)].
The distributors in question (Mr. and Mrs. Lafon) have the Monavie distributor identification number 2216622.
They operate the following Monavie sales websites:
http://feelthejuice2.blogspot.com
http://2216622.mymonavie.com
The contact information listed for Mr. Phillip A. Lafon is:
256 New Covenant Way
Ellenboro, NC 28040-4718
(828) 453-1631
feelthejuice2@gmail.com
Monavie LLC can be contacted at:
10855 River Front Parkway,
South Jordan, UT
(801) 748-3100
(866) 217-8455
compliance@monavie.com
Thank you in advance for your prompt attention to this very serious matter.
July 29th, 2010 at 4:58 pm
Vogel – a review of Phillip’s website confirms he hasn’t removed the illegal (and fraudulent) testimonials.
Looks like an FDA and FTC complaint to me.
July 29th, 2010 at 6:24 pm
I’m with you, Vogel.
My complaints to both the FTC and FDA have also been filed.
July 29th, 2010 at 8:31 pm
I’m kind of glad that he didn’ take it down and get away with fraud. I’d rather see the FDA fry him and the company.